[nattiej1976]

Originally Posted by reeskujo

Most of the cities here do the same...They ban or restrict the cross breeds as well and that again is another issue....Unless it is known who both of the parents are how can anyone be sure exactly what breeds are in a mixed breed dog without DNA testing?...A lot of dogs would be getting banned on assumptions made by their looks and that is certainly not fair...I think it's just another way for the various governmental systems to stick their noses in the peoples lives!

Very little DNA testing here in Australia.........You are a pit bull if you dont pass this test!!!!!

A dog is an American pit bull terrier where— (a)each body part specified in column 2 is graded in accordance with the assessment criteria specified in column 3 as having a grade of— (i)zero, if there is no compliance with the assessment criteria; or(ii)one, if there is part compliance with the assessment criteria; or(iii)two, if there is substantial compliance with the assessment criteria; or(iv)three, if there is full compliance with the assessment criteria; and (b)the total of all grades in accordance with paragraph (a) exceeds 45 out of a potential total of 66. Column 1 Item Column 2 Body part Column 3 Assessment criteria

1. Head The dog is medium in length (3:2).

2. Head shape The dog has a wedged shaped skull which is flat and widest at the ears with prominent cheeks free from wrinkles.

3. Muzzle The dog has a square, wide and deep muzzle.

4. Muzzle The dog has well pronounced jaws, displaying strength.

5. Upper teeth The dog’s upper teeth meet tightly over the lower teeth to create a

6. Ears The dog’s ears are set high on the head and are free from wrinkles.

7. Eyes The dog’s eyes are round to almond.

8. Eyes The dog’s eyes are set far apart, low down on the skull.

9. Nose The dog has wide open nostrils.

10. Neck The dog’s neck is muscular and slightly arched.

11. Neck The dog’s neck tapers from shoulder to head.

12. Neck The dog’s neck is free from looseness of skin.

13. Shoulders The dog’s shoulders are strong and muscular with wide sloping shoulder blades.

14. Loin The dog’s loins are short and strong.

15. Back The dog’s back is slightly sloping from withers to rump.

16. Back The dog’s back is slightly arched at the loins with the loins slightly tucked.

17. Chest The dog’s chest is deep, but not too broad, with well sprung ribs.

18. Tail The dog’s tail is short in comparison to the size of the dog, tapers to a fine point and is not carried over the back.

19. Legs The dog’s legs are medium to large, round boned and reasonably strong.

20. Feet The dog’s feet are of medium size.

21. Thighs The dog has well developed thigh muscles.

22. Coat The dog’s coat is short and stiff to touch


The Australian 22 point checklist, your dog fails, your dog is declaired PBT or part there of so therefore is dangerous. Depending in what council area you are as to whether complete ban or restriction applies.

The 22 point checklist, has sent many a family companion to its death, being used mostly in the Queensland State, however is slowly worming its way through the rest. Even if your dog is really a (example) lab cross greyhound, if it fails the physical test, carried out by trained professionals, (*note sarcasm*) it is declaired of PBT ancestory.

Try it on almost any medium to large cross breed dog you know, its likely that it fails. Hell try it on some of the common pure breed, they probably will fail to.

[nattiej1976]

Its a longer video, but will give you an idea of the stupidity of 22 point checklist used here, look at the breeds that fail the tests......????

YouTube - 22 Point Checklist

(if you look closely towards the end there happens to be a little shot of kato too )

[reeskujo]

Great video nattie...Thanks for sharing it...it just goes to show that without DNA testing you can't prove 100% what breeds are in a mixed breed just by looking at it and this is all the more reason why BSL is wrong and unfair!

[nattiej1976]

Originally Posted by Team Pupsters!

Akita's: A common choice of pet in the UK (and the US I believe), but why anyone would want to keep an animal that bred specifically for fighting is beyond me.

Akitas were naver breed specifically for fighting. The recorded domestic Akita history begins as a campanion and guard dog for Japanese royalty and high society.

They then started to become the compainon and guard for common society, reportedly often left at home to protect young children whilst parents were working the fields. They also became companions for hunters, often working as a male and female team to hold at bay big game until the hunters arrived.

The Akita was used for hunting because of their ability to be responsive yet silent as they captured their target.

American soldiers, saw the Akitas hunting and watched their ability to tackle bears so many times the Akitas size, and thought, because of their fearless ferocity, determination, and their thick protective hair, that they would be good as a pit fighting dog.........They tried, unsucessfully to make the Akita a good pit dog......their nature whilst responsive, is aloof and standoffish, and the Akitas would not put up the fancy, blood thirsty show that these barbarians wanted, so they started cross breeding the Akita with other breeds, still not able to get out of them the ultimate fighting dog, so the Akita became preceeded in the pit by the Japanese Tosa Inu.

Although the Tosa has a longer history of fighting than the Akita, and is banned from import into many countries because of this history, they are still capable of being an outstanding companion to a family, if trained and treated as it should be.

Other uses for the Akita because of their versatility and inteligence has been, army and service dogs, search and rescue dogs, livestock watch and protection, and several used instead of labs as assitance dogs for the vision impaired.

So, whilst the Akita did spend some time in the pit, please do not accuse them as a breed bred specifically for fighting, as ree said their time in the pit was very short lived.

[Tahla9999]

Originally Posted by Team Pupsters!

Just wondering which breeds (if any) do you think should be banned?

Before people get mad, I'm not just talking about breeds that are considered dangerous, I'm also talking about breeds which are a genetic disaster too. For example:

British Bull Dogs: Absolutely gorgeous dogs, but due to years of inbreeding, they suffer with so many physical problems and are in so much pain a lot of the time, that I don't think it's fair to them. That's why they tend not to live very long.

Shar Pei's: Pretty much the same as above. Shar Pei fever is incurable and it's an unpleasant demise for the dog. Approx 1 in 5 Shar Pei's are diagnosed with the condition, and tend to develop it when they are pups.

And here's a couple that I personally think should be banned because of their 'aggression'

American Pit Bulls: I know people keep them as pets in some parts of the world. But I think people in the UK understand why they are banned in this country, and I think it should stay that way.

Akita's: A common choice of pet in the UK (and the US I believe), but why anyone would want to keep an animal that bred specifically for fighting is beyond me. This one, I have to say is personal to me, because 14 years ago, I had a dog that was attacked by an akita without any provocation whatsoever. He survived (don't know how), but to this day I still get really upset over it. I do know someone who has an akita, and she has spent a lot of time and money taking her for special training. By her own admission, akita's are not her choice of breed, and she doesn't believe they should be kept as pets either. But in fairness to the owner, she more or less had the dog 'dumped' on her. Not many people over here want to rehome akita's, and she couldn't face having a healthy pup put to sleep when it had done nothing wrong.

So, over to you. What do you think????

Ban the American pit bull terrier? Oh boy, here we go again. In the UK, the thing that made people ban APBTs wasn't an APBT. It was a standford bull terrier that killed that five year old girl, BUT there not ban! When the news states that it was a pit bull that killed the girl, they could be talking about ANY breed that looks similar to the American pit bull terrier. Standfford bull terrier, american stanfford terrier, bull terrier and american bulldogs are stated under the term ''pit bull.'' Pit bull is not a breed. When you hear the news saying ''pit bull attacks owner'' it can be any of those breeds. People do not realize that.

Second, maybe YOU should research the breed before agreeing that they should be ban! APBTs were bred to dog fight but was never bred to be human aggressive. In fact, there probably the only breed that was bred against it. You see, people had to put their hands between fighting APBTs and any dog that showed aggression to the handler was culled. When the APBT was not fighting, it was a family dog. In fact, they were the number one family dog in america in 1900s. You could see APBTs on alot of advertisements back then because they were so gentle and loving. They represented America during world war 1. A pit bull was played in the little rascals as Petey. It was until the APBT was considered cool, in the 1970s, when people started getting these dogs for the wrong reason. The attacks started to rise and the pit bull was no longer america's dog. The APBT was not the only dog in america's history that was considered bad. First it was the german shepards, then the doberman pinscher, than the rotti, then finally the APBT. Now there are many bad apples in the breed but don't think that there all bad. I've never met a pit bull that wasn't loving. When I was little, I stuck my hand in a fence with a pit bull in it and it licked my hands.

If you get a well bred APBT, YOU GOT ONE OF THE MOST HUMAN SAFE DOGS IN THE WORLD. The APBT is great with kids because they can tolerant kids pulling their ears, but their not so good with other dogs. A responsible APBT owner knows that APBTs can be dog aggressive. They should never ever let their dog roam. In fact, most terrier breeds and bull dog breeds are dog aggressive. Should we ban all of them. All dogs can be dog aggressive, even golden retriever and labs. In fact, I've known many people who's dog was attacked by them. Many people love APBTs.

Don't take their number one breed away.:???:

[icongrl07]

I don't support banning breeds for any reason. If English Bulldogs are such poor physical specimens, then perhaps responsible breeders should focus on relieving some of their problems by expanding their breeding programs. Perhaps it is time to reexamine the breed standards of some dogs to allow for genetic expansion. Some people would like to ban breeds like APBT, AST, ST, Akita and others because they are "vicious." This is ridiculous! I don't know how many times it needs to be said before people understand, but owners have the biggest impact on a dog's behavior! The largest problems are people getting dogs after doing little to no research on the breed's needs or those who neglect/abuse their dogs. Think before you buy!!!

[Yogi]

the fact is that majority of attacks attributed to PBT's in the US are bogus and come down to one important fact. Simply put the majority of people in this country as well as the UK could not identify specifically a PBT from a short legged Boxer if their lives depended on it.
Here is a test and I can assure you that the majority of you will not get correct now can you take it and be honest?
Pet Pitbull - Find the Pit Bull
Of all the PBT's I have met and there have been a great deal, only one comes to mind that was not great with people. He would not attack unless someone confronted him which means if you ignored him he showed no interest.
Ignorance is common place in all countries through out the world which is why these issues come up. Mankind in itself is ignorant enough to not believe he is capable of it. This in itself only proves the point. The fact is in the US, more dog bites are attributed to the Cocker Spaniel than any breed. Go figure, obviously most who insist on banning haven't, or they would call for a ban on this breed also. There is no breed of dog like no breed of mankind where in there is a perfect socialized specimen. There is always going to be a bad apple and to judge all based on a few is nothing less than discrimination at it's worst. Being that humans are actually nothing more than a species of animal also, when is the ban going into effect on us. We do more killing, maiming and overall destruction than any other species of animal on the planet.....

[nattiej1976]

Originally Posted by Yogi

the fact is that majority of attacks attributed to PBT's in the US are bogus and come down to one important fact. Simply put the majority of people in this country as well as the UK could not identify specifically a PBT from a short legged Boxer if their lives depended on it.
Here is a test and I can assure you that the majority of you will not get correct now can you take it and be honest?
Pet Pitbull - Find the Pit Bull
Of all the PBT's I have met and there have been a great deal, only one comes to mind that was not great with people. He would not attack unless someone confronted him which means if you ignored him he showed no interest.
Ignorance is common place in all countries through out the world which is why these issues come up. Mankind in itself is ignorant enough to not believe he is capable of it. This in itself only proves the point. The fact is in the US, more dog bites are attributed to the Cocker Spaniel than any breed. Go figure, obviously most who insist on banning haven't, or they would call for a ban on this breed also. There is no breed of dog like no breed of mankind where in there is a perfect socialized specimen. There is always going to be a bad apple and to judge all based on a few is nothing less than discrimination at it's worst. Being that humans are actually nothing more than a species of animal also, when is the ban going into effect on us. We do more killing, maiming and overall destruction than any other species of animal on the planet.....

That one is a really good example of the mis judgement that some can make in idetifying The PBT, this being against just other recognised breeds of dogs too, not including the mass of mixes out there, that may have some similar features, build and body size and mass. Almost all of my friends who do have a mix, it is a staffy mix with another medium size dog, very often they too get mistaken by PBT out in the street, but if you really knew what they looked like, they are a far cry from true appearance.

By the way, I did get it first go, but i was tossing up on 3 diffrent pictures, so could have just as easily got it wrong.

[TexasTig]

I agree that NO dog breed should be banned. . . because everyone has his or her own opinions. . . and you cannot make everyone happy. . . so don't take out one breed just because some dogs are not properly trained. . .

[AnnaBella]

Banning certain dog breeds is plain bs. You are attacking the symptom instead of the problem, witch is irresponsible owners. Ban these people from owning dogs instead.