[lil mutt]

nice idea!there are many people who are looking for a good breeder who are not only after for the money.

[suebgone]

So let me see if I understand this correctly.
Any breeder that ships puppies, or lets their puppies leave home before 12-14 weeks of age is not reputable or responsible?

If this is what you mean, then I would assume that the majority of the breeders winning AKC Championships with their dogs, that have phenominal dogs, bred to other phenominal dogs, that produce amazing quality puppies that also win AKC championships are not reputable or responsible breeders because they will ship their puppies both Nationwide and Internationally... and if you pick the puppy up yourself you can pick it up as early as 7-8 weeks of age. Is that right?

do your AKC friends ship their puppies to any JQP anywhere? do they ship 6 week old, unvaccinated puppies to anyone that wants one? these are not the type breeder the average Joe will ever encounter.

Just for the record - I know several people that bred aussie's, chessie's, cockers & several others that no puppy leaves before 14 weeks.

I guess it all depends on your standards

[OkieCanineMommy]

Originally Posted by suebgone

So let me see if I understand this correctly.
Any breeder that ships puppies, or lets their puppies leave home before 12-14 weeks of age is not reputable or responsible?

If this is what you mean, then I would assume that the majority of the breeders winning AKC Championships with their dogs, that have phenominal dogs, bred to other phenominal dogs, that produce amazing quality puppies that also win AKC championships are not reputable or responsible breeders because they will ship their puppies both Nationwide and Internationally... and if you pick the puppy up yourself you can pick it up as early as 7-8 weeks of age. Is that right?

do your AKC friends ship their puppies to any JQP anywhere? do they ship 6 week old, unvaccinated puppies to anyone that wants one? these are not the type breeder the average Joe will ever encounter.

Just for the record - I know several people that bred aussie's, chessie's, cockers & several others that no puppy leaves before 14 weeks.

I guess it all depends on your standards

I am not saying they are my friends..... I was asking if what I read from your post was correct.

I've never heard of shipping a puppy through the air lines before 12-14 weeks.....

however I have seen, heard of and even met AKC breeders that own,show, and breed champions. That ship internationally and nationwide, and will allow you to personally pick the puppy up at 7-8 weeks of age.

I do not believe this makes them irresponsible or non-reputable breeders.

I would buy a puppy from a kennel like "Kimbertal Kennels" any day of the week... and am considering doing so in the next year or so.

[suebgone]

well, oakie there are thousands of infants being shipped much to young. check with any vet about it, if the puppy even makes it to the vet. ask at any shelter about it. read ads for puppies for sale on almost any site.

you can't see how Mr. Yarnell's place is a puppy mill? look at the number of dogs he sells. he is licensed with the highest breeding kennel license there is in PA. a K-V ( 5 ) which means he can have any amount over 251 & he does.

did you notice he has 2 kinds of puppies for sale? do you know what breeder puppies are?
those are the ones he sells to any JQP that comes along. they have to sign a contract to bring the bitch back to be bred to the dog of his choice & then you take her home & pay the vet bills, take the risk & do all the work. when the puppies are old enough - they go back to him. that's how he can advertise "home raised" altho many are not

and I stand by what I said.

[chi]

All one has to do is look up ads on craigslist.com for animal adoptions to see how screwed up breeders are anyway. There are a lot of sweet dogs needing homes and many irresponsible breeders and owners (and dog snobs) perpetuating a sad, sad problem.

If one were truly a dog lover and cared about those little lives out there, one would see this clearly and not support breeders.

[schnauzermum]

First of all, I just want to say thank you to everyone that took the time to post such kind responses to my original post.

It has been over a year now since we lost Lacie, and I can honestly say that not a single day goes by that I don't think about her. I miss her more than words could ever say, and I just hope that she knows how much we truly loved her.

For what it's worth, I also wanted to say that even though there are a lot of irresponsible breeders out there that have no business breeding dogs, there are also good breeders out there, that love their dogs and breed their dogs with the highest level of standards and knowledge.

YES, there are way too many dogs out there that are in need of homes, and it is absolutely wonderful when someone can adopt a dog and give it a second chance at having the life that it deserves. BUT what we can't forget is that this is not always something that everyone can do.

When I went through what I did with my dogs, I wrote a letter to the editor to my local newspaper. It was published. A week later, an anonymous writer wrote a letter putting me down and telling me that it was my fault because I got my dog from a breeder instead of a pound or humane society. I so badly wanted to respond by letting this person know that we we couldn't adopt a dog from a pound or shelter because of my husband's allergies. A schnauzer was one of the only dogs that we could have that he could actually live with without having a serious reaction to!

I decided to leave it alone, and that it wasn't worth it to defend myself against someone that was capable of such ignorance.

When someone insinuates that it is breeders that are responsible for so many dogs that do not get adopted, I can't help wonder...why is the finger never pointed at the irresponsible people that don't bother to get their pets fixed, and as a result, end up with unwanted puppies that never find good homes?...or the people that get a dog and then just decide they don't want it anymore?...or the people that let their dogs wander and could care less where they end up?...there are so many reasons that this problem exists...yet it is breeders in general that are criticized along with the people that decide they want a purebred dog that are often hugely blamed for this problem.

It is not (reputable) breeders or the people that decide to get a purebred dog that are causing this epidemic.

It is the consequence of irresponsible people, puppy mills, pet stores, and as far as I'm concerned...idiots that have no sense of the word responsibility, that are initiating this problem.

It is not wrong to get a dog from a good breeder, and in choosing to do so, does not make you accountable or responsible for the fact that many dogs out there are in need of homes.

People decide to adopt dogs for many different reasons, and people also buy purebred dogs for many different reasons. No one has the right to put down or criticize someone for what they choose.

If that is the case, then people shouldn't have their own biological children either, because there are far too many children out there that need to be adopted! And the people that do have their own children are just perpetuating the problem!

...pretty ridiculous if you ask me.

[ChrisO23]

That is horrible that a person could have the nerve to sell or even call themself a breeder. That is why it is so important as a dog buyer to do your research when looking for a puppy and make sure you get info and background on the breeder. Alot of breeders with offer a type of gurantee if they are a legit breeder.

[LoveMyLabs]

Originally Posted by suebgone

do your AKC friends ship their puppies to any JQP anywhere? do they ship 6 week old, unvaccinated puppies to anyone that wants one? these are not the type breeder the average Joe will ever encounter.

Just for the record - I know several people that bred aussie's, chessie's, cockers & several others that no puppy leaves before 14 weeks.

I guess it all depends on your standards

What a good breeder does is question the potential owners about living conditions, the home, family, time that will be spent with the pup, etc. They also make sure the guarantee states that pups will get all required vaccinations in their new home, spayed/neutered, on LR and rabies. Unless it's a show quality pup, then FR, not spayed/neutered but (more than likely) on a co-ownership until pup is champion titled and has had proper health certs before breeding. They NEVER ship 6 wk old pups. Earliest is 8 wks old and vaccinated to approved homes.
If your "breeder" chooses to keep their pups til 14 wks that's their perogative. Most only do that with small breed dogs or those that are getting some sort of training before they leave (or if they'd like to see if they are going to be show quality - in which case it may be 6 mo of age before they go to their show home).

[FATBOY Aussie Bulldogs]

Hi Schnauzer mum,

That is a terrible story. I really feel for you. You need to report that breeder to the ANKC, as there are very strict guidelines and a 'code of ethics' to be followed when breeding. These people need to be accountable for what they are doing, and they should be responsable enough to stop breeding from the dog or dogs that are carrying the genetic trait that produced these pups. Its not fair on you, and its definitely not fair on the pups themselves to have such a poor quality of life. People should not be breeding as a way of generating money, they should be breeding with the vision of bettering the breed, with a genuine focus on quality not quantity. Very sad.

[schnauzermum]

Thank you FATBOY Aussie Bulldogs. Aside from taking the breeder to small claims court, I did try to report her to the CKC (Canadian Kennel Club) but unfortunately they gave me the whole spew on how they do not mandate or have any control over what a specific breeder does as far as breeding practices go!!! I was told that their listed breeding practices are only "suggestions" and that they have no control over whether or not a breeder follows their code of ethics, breeding standards, etc. They did say I could file a formal complaint, but that it would cost me a filing fee that was almost $300 which would basically give the breeder a slap on the wrist...if even that!!! The CKC was completely usless and they do not do anything to protect dogs. As far as I'm concerned they are basically just a useless organization that has one focus...profit.

I also contacted my local and Provincial humane societies, the MSCC (Miniature Schnauzer Club of Canada - which the breeder is not a member of) , lawyers, even my local MP, you name it! The reason I cannot do anything is because in Canada there is no existing law that protects dogs from these types of breeders. We have something called the Animal Pedigree Act, but it does nothing to protect the breed. Infact after reading it, I discovered that it actually protects the breeder more than anything!