[Bobbijean]

I dont have a spay nuter contract, it will be something I will have to look into.

I used to do pmr rescue so I do know about screenings and home checks. Do you ever sell your dogs online? I was considering that.

How long are normal health guarantees for? if your dogs have been checked for genetic defects, how long do you say a puppy will be without them.

I can have a c section preformed yes. I feed royal canin and they have a special diet for pregnant and lactating bitches.

I was able to afford all the parvo treatments on 6 dogs.

Im not some stupid Hick that sits in my shotgun shack breeding puggle or bugs or offering registration for pikachis. I dont have a breeding kennel in my back yard. I have several pet dogs that are all dutifully spayed and nutered accordingly.

I have and old what looks like sortof a min pin bitch that has a tatoo on her inner thigh that I picked up running scared down the road, she is vetted and OMG on the teeth cleaning.

I have a mut that someone said they were going to shoot, she will be spayed soon.

I have a love bug crested that is nutered.

sometimes I try to take my husband in to get it done but when we pull into the vets he get wise to what is going on.

I have always had interest in the IG"S I bought the most expensive ones I could afford, and my intention is to breed them.

and thats the way it is.

[reeskujo]

I have never nor would I ever sell a puppy on line..Responsible breeders don't do that because there's no way to assure what type of home the puppy will be going to...I gave a 1 year health guarantee and would not only take the puppy back but refund the money if something went wrong with them health wise during that time...I also gave out only limited registration on pet quality pups which required them to be spayed/neutered by the time they were 8 months old...I also had prospective owners fill out a lengthy application to be sure they knew about the breed and were capable of handling it..Plus I did a home check...All of my breeders had titles and conformations which is done to show that they meet the standard of the breed...They were tested for genetics to make sure they didn't carry any of the health issues the breed is prone to and their hips,eyes and hearts were certified.....I'm curious to know if your breeding pair's parents have had all of these health checks done and if they have titles or conformations?...How far back can you trace their pedigree?

[Yogi]

Originally Posted by Bobbijean

I dont have a spay nuter contract, it will be something I will have to look into.

I used to do pmr rescue so I do know about screenings and home checks. Do you ever sell your dogs online? I was considering that.

How long are normal health guarantees for? if your dogs have been checked for genetic defects, how long do you say a puppy will be without them.

I can have a c section preformed yes. I feed royal canin and they have a special diet for pregnant and lactating bitches.

I was able to afford all the parvo treatments on 6 dogs.

Im not some stupid Hick that sits in my shotgun shack breeding puggle or bugs or offering registration for pikachis. I dont have a breeding kennel in my back yard. I have several pet dogs that are all dutifully spayed and nutered accordingly.

I have and old what looks like sortof a min pin bitch that has a tatoo on her inner thigh that I picked up running scared down the road, she is vetted and OMG on the teeth cleaning.

I have a mut that someone said they were going to shoot, she will be spayed soon.

I have a love bug crested that is nutered.

sometimes I try to take my husband in to get it done but when we pull into the vets he get wise to what is going on.

I have always had interest in the IG"S I bought the most expensive ones I could afford, and my intention is to breed them.

and thats the way it is.

I can see where some here may be concerned with the approach you are showing. Rescuing dogs though noble is in no way prepares one to be a good breeder of dogs.
You say you went out and purchased the most expensive IG's and want to breed. Unfortunately you missed on that mark. Most expensive in no way guarantees that the dog is in any way quality or anything more than pet.
What do you really know about IG's? If you really do know than expensive would not have been the choice of words used to determine breeding quality.
I was rescuing dogs long before most ever thought of it. I also bred for over 47 years. As pointed out, contracts, breed knowledge to those interested in purchase, questionaires in addition to the necessary health checks for the breed were all things I did from the beginning. While I limited greatly the number of litters over the years and know for a fact that you do not make money at this that the sole purpose was to better the breed, not just breed.
IG's are not what most people think they are. It may be something you should take under advisement as given here by so many and take time to study the breeds and the responsibility of breeding before endeavoring to take this one in such a way so that no one will question you with regards to your ethics and motive. Good luck.

[schnauzermum]

There is a question that I would like to ask to any breeder that is willing to answer. A good breeder will offer a health guarantee. The guarantee should be comprehensive and meaningful, as well as signed and dated by both the breeder and the puppy buyer.

In my (cynical) search to find a good breeder...and I admit completely that I am cynical, perhaps extremely cautious is a better word; however, rightfully so, as I have been through a horrible experience with my schnauzers due to an irresponsible breeder. I have experienced first hand what happens to dogs that have genetic disorders.

I have been in contact with several breeders to ask them questions and see if they would be a breeder that I would feel comfortable getting another dog from in the future. I will tell you that there is one thing that steers me away and that is when a breeder only offers a 1 year health guarantee. I have been told numerous times (by different breeders) that this is 'standard' among dog breeders. I realize that health guarantees are not all the same and that after that 1st year, the value of the dog is pro-rated depending on the breeders guarantee.

My question is why? Why is a one year health guarantee considered to be standard, or sufficient for that matter? Especially when most known (genetic) breed defects are late-onset, with symptoms that are often delayed for several years before they even become apparent?

Many genetic diseases, disorders and defects are not recognized in the first year of the dogs life. If you were to look up the MOST common canine genetic disorders, most of them are not detected before the dog reaches a year old.

To support this...

Hip Dyslasia - I realize that testing can be done to identify this disorder, but it
can still occur, and often does occur in middle aged to older
dogs. It is a genetic flaw that can be very serious and greatly
affect a dog's quality of life.

MAC susceptability, Avian TB (Mycobacterium Avium)- This is a very serious
genetic flaw that is most often not apparent until the dog is
around 2 years old. This genetic mutation leads to the dog
having a compromised immune system that prevents their body
from fighting off this deadly bacteria. It is genetic and fatal.

Cushings disease - again, most often not discovered until the dog is older.

Portosystemic shunt - although it is sometimes detected in a young pup, this
genetic defect is often not discovered until the dog is older.

Hyperlipidemia - Also not commomnly discovered until the dog is middle-aged

Megaesophagus - Often not detected until dog is middle-aged

Mytonia congenita - Another serious problem that is debilitating and not
usually diagnosed until the dog is a few years old.


...I realize that I could go on and on here, but the point that I am trying to make is that if there are so many common canine genetic disorders that are not detected until the dog is at least a few years old, than why do some breeders only offer health guarantees for one year?

I am not trying to insult anyone by posting this, I am just asking to see what people have to say.

I also realize that genetic testing is done by reputable breeders, and that no breeder can guarantee their dogs against ever having genetic problems. Genetic flaws happen and the way in which they are passed is very complex, and I realize that.

I just wanted to ask any breeder in general for their input.

[nattiej1976]

Katos breeder has a life time health guarentee, if he was to ever suffer from any proven genetic condition at any stage in his life time, we will be refunded purchase price........it probably would never cover the cost of the vet bill for that sort of thing really, but it is nice to know that she backs the quality of her pups up for their natural life.

[Bobbijean]

Just exactly who decides what is ethical?

who got appointed that job. people I have sold dogs to in the past are very happy in their purchases. I will aways take a dog back.

but the reason most likely for returns.... I dont have room Im having a baby etc... thats unethical in my book. But there are situations in everyones life that they just got the wrong dog. my life style has changed.

I dont believe I owe them anything. but i understand their situation.

You all are very helpfull and you ask honestly pertinent questions.

I will most likely breed this pair after the genetics testing, I believe thats what I should do to insure the parents are sound.

Thanks BTW as far as Im concerned the girl is too young 9 months so Ill wait till next year till she is about 1 1/2 years.

[Bobbijean]

I knew when I said it, I should have said, I bought the best quality I could afford.

[crossbreeddogs]

Hey the more money the better I always say!! I breed for MONEY!! Why else bother with all the headache and hassle otherwise??? And any idiot who says they do it just for doing the world a favor by adding another barking dog to the neighborhood is a BIG liar. We are all in it for the money and if I had the room I'd quit my job and fill every inch of a farm with the little slobbering money bags. The new cross breed dog craze is a gold mine too!! These people pay top dollar for the same dogs they could find at a pound. Suckers. It's all about the money and don't let some self righteous person tell you otherwise. No one in thier right mind would add more dogs to death row in every pound in every city across the US if it weren't for the money. Some of us just do it more humain than others but hey we are all the same in the end, just some of us are nicer to our money makers!:-D

[reeskujo]

People like you make me sick!...if you think your dogs are nothing more then a hassle why do you bother?...your greedy that's why....BYB's like you are the reason so many dogs wind up in shelters...You don't care about weather or not your breeding temperment or physical problems into your pups which you probably are and dogs like that wind up getting dumped...people like you are a disgrace to to responsible breeders and breeders who really love their animals....We are not liars...We do not breed for the money because done right there's no money to be made!...You wouldn't know that though because yoy most likely don't do it right or responsibly!!!