[Yorkiepoo Babe]

Hi everyone,
I have been breading from my home for about four years and i currently have a set of almost four-week old yorkie-poos (my favorite cross). The litter belongs to my older bitch (i have two females) and this is her 7th and final litter (we meant to stop at six but our male is very determined when it comes to sex lol). Anyway today she started being very aggressive to her puppies and she has never shown this behavior before. She kicked them out of her pen and won't let them in without attacking. Usually she'll just assert her dominance in the seventh week but never to this extent. I have separated her from the litter for the time being, but I was wondering if anyone has experienced this behavior before and what to do? Libby has really become one of my favorite dogs and I am not willing to give her away if this persists but I'm worried what she'll do when Lucy (the younger bitch) has her next litter! Thanks for replying!
Beth

[leashedForLife]

and as i have zero interest in supporting such a pastime-for-profit, i have zero interest in giving away what i have learned with my own effort and investment over the past 20-plus years, as a trainer.

i would personally be in strong support of desexing all 3 adult dogs.
best regards,
--- terry

[Yorkiepoo Babe]

Well thankyou for your incorrect assumption but I am not running a puppymill! I make barely a cent breading my puppies. I love them to death. I work as a vets assistant and I bring my puppies into the clinic all the time so that I can spend as much time with them as I can. I have donated five... FIVE puppies to the little yellow dog organization that Auctions off the puppies for good causes. My animals have pens that are in my own house with door that never close. they can go where they please. THEY ARE MY PETS. THEY SLEEP IN MY BED. I HAVE SEEN COUNTLESS ABUSE CASES FROM PUPPY MILLS IN MY JOB AND I AM DEEPLY OFFENDED THAT YOU PUT ME IN THAT CATEGORY. How dare you?! If I was trying to make a quick buck I wouldn't care about where my animals go but I have never given a puppy to someone who I have not known or who have not been connected to me by a friend and the people bidding in Little Yellow Dog are hardly the kind of people to be nasty to an animal. Would I be breeding my dogs larger to be healthy playful family pets rather than sickly and small runts that everyone seems to want if i was trying to make money? Would I refuse to sell my dogs to pet stores and instead personally meet every new owner myself if i was trying make make a quick buck? I would suggest to not be so quick to judge a person you don't know. Do you really think if I was a puppymill I would really give a damn that she was acting this way?! Let's think before we speak shall we!!

[Yorkiepoo Babe]

Originally Posted by leashedForLife

and as i have zero interest in supporting such a pastime-for-profit, i have zero interest in giving away what i have learned with my own effort and investment over the past 20-plus years, as a trainer.

i would personally be in strong support of desexing all 3 adult dogs.
best regards,
--- terry

I see the great caring and concern you have for the animals by not helping with the problems at all! What a true hero you are.

[Lara's mom]

The breeder I got my newest Jack Russell puppy from is having a similar issue. This will also be the mom's last litter. She hasn't been outright aggressive toward her pups but, she's made it crystal clear that she's fed up with them and considers her job done and it is earlier than with any of her past litters. My breeder has separated the pups from mom for a large part of the day and that seems to have helped.

[Yorkiepoo Babe]

Thankyou! I'll just keep her separate from the pups for a majority of the time, although I hate restricting her to other parts of the house. I'm sure you are right, she's probably done with being a mom. Thankyou for your input!

[superfly jacks]

Yorkie-poo,

I do not believe in cross-breeding of dogs it is like anything else these days just a fad and a money maker for most.

You had mentioned your female has had 7 litters and now is getting aggressive maybe she is just fed-up with being a mother.

You also mentioned that we did not mean for our female to have a 7th litter and that is your males fault, that would be your responsibility as a breeder to keep him away from your bitch.
Such as if you have any daughters of his around you would not want them to be bred either by him.

And to give away puppies to be auctioned off is just as bad as selling them to a pet store.
No screening of the puppies new familes have been done by their breeder that loves and cares for them or no consideration as to where they go.
Nothing would make me give away one of my puppies to anyone without knowing where they are going and also what type of life they would live.

[Yogi]

I have to agree with Superfly. As a breeder I have to meet in person those interested in my pups. My most recent one was sold to a woman who flew to Vancouver BC from Fort Saskatchewan Alberta than drove to Seattle so I could meet her in person and feel comfortable that she in fact knew my breed and what was to be expected.
Over the years there have been many that I have simply told no to. Not all breeds are meant for all people. It is crucial that breeds are matched up with individuals or families that will understand their energy levels etc and compliment each other. Failing to do so is one of the primary reasons there are so many dogs in rescue now.
This is not to be critical of you, but to point out that you are assuming far too much when you allow your pups to be auctioned off thus assume they are in fact going to good homes. The number of dogs purchased each year only because the look "cute" then to find out the buyer was simply ignorant and failed to research what they were getting themselves into would have been easily avoided had they first met and were screened by the breeder.
I ask a lot of questions and failing to answer properly or correctly results in no sale or even giving of one of my pups to an individual. In no way am I being mean but instead working to protect the pup from a rescue or even worse, be surrendered to someone I do not know. Contracts go with my dogs and they are legal and binding calling for the dog to return to me if for any reason they are not able to keep them. Luckily, mine have lived out their lives with those who have purchased from me. I also have an obligation as a breeder to rescue and of my 24 dogs, 16 are rescues.

[Lara's mom]

I do not, nor will I ever condone the breeding of so called "designer dogs." Further, the idea of auctioning off a puppy like a piece of furniture frankly revolts me.

However, "done is done." The puppies are already here so there is no turning back the clock. I agree 100% with both Yogi and Superfly. It shouldn't have happened in the first place but since it did, the member involved has an absolute responsibility to ensure that each and every puppy goes to a good and loving home. I don't care how good the cause is. I would never give/sell a puppy without meeting the potential parent and asking one hell of a lot of questions. If I wasn't satisfied, the puppy would remain with me.

This particular issue was about a mother who was fed up with her puppies so, I gave the best advice that I could based on my limited knowledge.

I sometimes think that we would be able to educate more people if we used a slightly less confrontational approach. Maybe it's just me but I respond much better to information that educates me than I do with "getting dumped on." I have often thought that this is something we could be doing better in this forum.

[Yorkiepoo Babe]

I would just like to calmly clear a few things up. When Libby got pregnant this last time we had separated her into a different room from my male and we had also put a belly band on him. I had to work late one night so my boyfriend came to my house to take out the dogs (with instructions not to take Libby out with the other two, but to take her out separately.) He ofcourse did not listen and took them out as a group and he obviously removed the doggy diaper from libby and the belly band from pippen. Well you can probably figure out the rest. Once is all it takes. I was not being carefree with the situation as someone said earlier! I understand if some of you are not comfortable with the auctions but I have done this a few times and I am the person who is there when they auction the pup and I have met the buyers. Its nearly always the same family in our town who purchases the dog and they have a habbit of then giving the dog to the family who the auction is being held for. Its very nice from my point of view and the auction is often for sick children or families who have lost a parent. I also support that this message board should perhaps be less confrontational and less about dumping!!

[Yorkiepoo Babe]

Also I cross because the crosses are beautiful and because they eliminate alot of the genetic problems that purebreds experience from over-breeding! Besides, how did these purebreds come to be? People mixed animals to isolate certain traits they were looking for (this also solidified certain undesirable traits within some breeds) and the resulting animals that possessed the traits were the purebreds. Me and many other breeders cross and we are doing the exact same thing people from years ago were doing! In 100 years or maybe less some of the current hybrids will be considered their own breed. In the cat world a Himalayan is a mix between a siamese and a persian but its now considered its own breed. I personally see more problems with breeding dogs to a point where they can't even maintain their species without human interference (english bulldogs for instance)

[Yogi]

Originally Posted by Yorkiepoo Babe

Also I cross because the crosses are beautiful and because they eliminate alot of the genetic problems that purebreds experience from over-breeding! Besides, how did these purebreds come to be? People mixed animals to isolate certain traits they were looking for (this also solidified certain undesirable traits within some breeds) and the resulting animals that possessed the traits were the purebreds. Me and many other breeders cross and we are doing the exact same thing people from years ago were doing! In 100 years or maybe less some of the current hybrids will be considered their own breed. In the cat world a Himalayan is a mix between a siamese and a persian but its now considered its own breed. I personally see more problems with breeding dogs to a point where they can't even maintain their species without human interference (english bulldogs for instance)

In actuality, cross breeding in more cases than not actually only adds to the likelihood of genetic health issues as you have now doubled up the chances.
Breeding for the sake of beauty is in no way a valid reason to breed or cross breed. As for breeders who started the idea of mix breeding, they did so long ago then spent generations working on the genetic health issues to weed out as much as possible. In addition, they were never bred because they looked beautiful but had a working purpose.
As for the auction philosophy, granted you meet the people who won the pup in auction but that is as far as it goes. The fact is you meet potential owners before they buy, not after. By doing so you are showing proper breeding concerns for your pups to ensure they are in fact going to a knowledgeable owner. By auctioning you are doing no more than a breeder who sells their pups to a pet store. You have no say so in where they end up only that in the case of an auction you meet the winning bidder.
I appreciate that you are attempting in a sincere way to justify the breeding you are doing but as one who has been involved for over 50 years, you are going about it the wrong way.
It is you that has to understand that when you come on a forum, you may not always hear what you want to hear. The idea of a forum is a place to discuss and debate issues and concerns. In this format, you must learn to expect to hear things that may offend you but unless someone is insulting you via fowl language the person replying has as much right to their opinion as you do. All you can do is plead your case for what you do, but in turn expect that others will plead theirs that contradict yours.

[Yorkiepoo Babe]

Most genetic problems are recessive and are often linked in with other traits. For instance low hips are often accompanied by displasia, yet certain breeds are bred for the low hip!) (just an example. others are the squat build that prevents natural breeding in english bulldogs or joint and back problems seen in many others) When you mix two breeds that do not both share the common recessive trait (because you must have homologous recessive genotype to see the problem) The trait is not seen because it is recessive to the dominant trait. Granted when you start breeding second generation hybrids one in four can get a defective trait if it both parent recieved the recessive gene and passed it on, but by breeding first generation hybrids a lot of problems seen in certain breeds can be canceled out while still giving perspective owners the look and temperament of the breed they were looking for.

[Lara's mom]

I think the point here is that you are not creating a new breed. Fancy names notwithstanding, these dogs are mixed breeds. Visit any shelter in North America and you will find that they are full to overflowing with mixed breed dogs. There simply aren't enough homes for them all. Thousands of wonderful dogs are put to death every week because the shelters simply don't have sufficient space to house them. By deliberately allowing even more mixed breeds to be born, you are adding to an already overwhelming problem. For every one you deliberately bring into the world, somewhere, another dog dies.

My other objection to these so called "designer dogs" is that there are a lot of dishonest people out there breeding them and passing them off as some kind of new breed which they are not and charging uninformed potential owners ridiculous sums of money for them.

Don't kid yourself. Puppy mills and backyard breeders have seen the potential to make money off of these puppies and there is currently an explosion in the number of these puppies being born, usually in terrible conditions. They receive little or no medical care. In the eyes of those who run puppy mills, dogs are livestock; nothing more, nothing less. The mothers live out their lives in quiet desperation, being bred repeatedly until they are no longer of any use to the puppy mill owner at which point they are killed to make room for another bitch to live a life of misery. And so the cycle goes on...Far too many of these puppies suffer from both serious health and behavioural issues. You would be shocked at how many "designer dogs" end up being surrendered to shelters. Their poor health and behavioural problems often deem them unadoptable. At that point, they join the thousands of dogs who are put to death every week.

I've never met a reputable breeder who actually made money from a litter of puppies. In fact, they are usually considerably "in the hole" by the time the care of the pregnant mother and her puppies are factored in. They do it for the love of their chosen breed and to improve that breed. Their dogs are tested for genetic defects BEFORE they are bred and are bred for temperment as well as conformation. A reputable breeder never wants to see one of their puppies end up in a shelter and will take them back if the owner can no longer keep the dog and either rehome them or keep them for the duration of their lives.

There is a lot more involved to breeding than just wanting to produce cute puppies. This is why you are getting such strong disagreement from the breeders who do things the correct way. I know that it's unlikely that anyone will change your mind but, I hope you will at least take some time to think about what everyone has said. You are responsible for every puppy that you allow to be brought into this world. With so many unwanted dogs out there, especially mixed breeds, ask yourself honestly if you really want to be a part of contributing to an already enormous problem.

[cigwyllt]

Don't think there is such a thing as puppy that isn't cute. And very few adults that aren't as well. The cute factor and physical appearance are no reason at all to produce a litter of pups.

[Yogi]

Originally Posted by Yorkiepoo Babe

Most genetic problems are recessive and are often linked in with other traits. For instance low hips are often accompanied by displasia, yet certain breeds are bred for the low hip!) (just an example. others are the squat build that prevents natural breeding in english bulldogs or joint and back problems seen in many others) When you mix two breeds that do not both share the common recessive trait (because you must have homologous recessive genotype to see the problem) The trait is not seen because it is recessive to the dominant trait. Granted when you start breeding second generation hybrids one in four can get a defective trait if it both parent recieved the recessive gene and passed it on, but by breeding first generation hybrids a lot of problems seen in certain breeds can be canceled out while still giving perspective owners the look and temperament of the breed they were looking for.

Three problems, you are not breeding a true breed but a mutt. Secondly, recessive or not, as all purebred dogs carry with them to one degree or another genetic issues, by mixing breeds you will always increase the chance of one if not all from both breeds being carried over. Thirdly, there is no such thing as a hybrid in dogs. The definition of hybrid is when you cross two totally different species ie: cat to dog etc. Breeding two purebred dogs of different breeds only creates mutts, not hybrids.

Originally Posted by Lara's mom

I think the point here is that you are not creating a new breed. Fancy names notwithstanding, these dogs are mixed breeds. Visit any shelter in North America and you will find that they are full to overflowing with mixed breed dogs. There simply aren't enough homes for them all. Thousands of wonderful dogs are put to death every week because the shelters simply don't have sufficient space to house them. By deliberately allowing even more mixed breeds to be born, you are adding to an already overwhelming problem. For every one you deliberately bring into the world, somewhere, another dog dies.

My other objection to these so called "designer dogs" is that there are a lot of dishonest people out there breeding them and passing them off as some kind of new breed which they are not and charging uninformed potential owners ridiculous sums of money for them.

Don't kid yourself. Puppy mills and backyard breeders have seen the potential to make money off of these puppies and there is currently an explosion in the number of these puppies being born, usually in terrible conditions. They receive little or no medical care. In the eyes of those who run puppy mills, dogs are livestock; nothing more, nothing less. The mothers live out their lives in quiet desperation, being bred repeatedly until they are no longer of any use to the puppy mill owner at which point they are killed to make room for another bitch to live a life of misery. And so the cycle goes on...Far too many of these puppies suffer from both serious health and behavioural issues. You would be shocked at how many "designer dogs" end up being surrendered to shelters. Their poor health and behavioural problems often deem them unadoptable. At that point, they join the thousands of dogs who are put to death every week.

I've never met a reputable breeder who actually made money from a litter of puppies. In fact, they are usually considerably "in the hole" by the time the care of the pregnant mother and her puppies are factored in. They do it for the love of their chosen breed and to improve that breed. Their dogs are tested for genetic defects BEFORE they are bred and are bred for temperment as well as conformation. A reputable breeder never wants to see one of their puppies end up in a shelter and will take them back if the owner can no longer keep the dog and either rehome them or keep them for the duration of their lives.

There is a lot more involved to breeding than just wanting to produce cute puppies. This is why you are getting such strong disagreement from the breeders who do things the correct way. I know that it's unlikely that anyone will change your mind but, I hope you will at least take some time to think about what everyone has said. You are responsible for every puppy that you allow to be brought into this world. With so many unwanted dogs out there, especially mixed breeds, ask yourself honestly if you really want to be a part of contributing to an already enormous problem.

As a breeder, I can attest that by the time testing, de-worming, shots micro-chipping pups, litter registration etc is done I don't see anything but a bill from my vet for the balance still due him for the litter once they are sold.
In order to make a profit you generally are mix breeding with cute names and asking prices more than a purebred that is registered. Or you are passing off purebreds as "teacups". These are nothing more than sales gimmicks that entice the unsuspecting public to ill born pups or glorified mixes that have nothing to truly offer but the potential of health issues down the road.

[enchantment]

I am sorry but I have to agree that producing cross breeds/mutts AND selling them for money is very unethical. I wish people would realize that the only people that should be breeding dogs are the ones who are true and dedicated to their individual breed. Breeds are being ruined due to back yard breeders or so called designer breeders. I don't care how clean or how well you look after your dogs or how much you love them, you are not doing anything for the individual breeds you have. Tell me, what health testing do you do on your breeding stock?? Do you know what genetic health problems your individual breeds can be afflicked with?? How do you do pedigree research to look for certain genetic health problems in a particular line?? Where do you purchase your breeding stock from?? Very unlikely you are purchasing from a reputable breeder who does health testing and pedigree research, because a reputable breeder will not sell to someone who is not serious about their breed and try to preserve and better it. Even though you think you are "doing it right", you are not. If you enjoy breeding so much then focus on one breed, go to some dog shows, talk to breeders, do research on ethical breeding, find a reputable breeder who will take you under their wing and teach you the right way to breed dogs, the ethical way. It is still alot of fun and joy doing it the ethical way. It is however not cheap at times, very hard work, sometimes heartbreaking, but can be very rewarding. Learn how to show your dogs, This can also be very fun and very rewarding.
Another thing, stop giving your puppies way to an organization to find homes for them, if you want to donate dogs/puppies, give them to an oganization who train them for assisting the handicapped (hearing dogs, etc.) Small dogs can be working dogs too. This will have people give you respect, not negative judgment. ALWAYS screen your puppy buyers. I always ask for vet references. If they have never had a dog before, I use my own judgment; assess the research they have done on owning/raising/training a dog. I look at how they interact with the dogs as well as their children.
So you see, you can still breed dogs and do it ethically.
If I have a girl in season, and I don't want her bred, there is no way my male is going to get to her. They do not have contact if I am not using him or her. You must have secure crates they cannot escape from. Mine are all house pets but are also crate trained, for this reason.
Anyways, just my opinion, I do hope you think about changing your thoughts on breeding.