[Todd]

Heys guys. We've all heard read the articles online and the ads for various e-books which say that with a healthy diet/lifestyle a dog can live for 27 years. Do you guys really think there's any truth to this?

I personally don't know. This statement is far to generalizes considering the variation of sizes we see in domestic dogs today. It does seem to be at least semi realitic though, considering wolves in captivity live an average of 16-20 years and they are bigger than domestic dogs, especially smaller breeds.

So my question is, with a healthy diet (raw in my opinion or at least something staying away from commercial dog food, poor kibble especially) do you think the statement that dogs can live to the age of 27 has any truth to it?

[Lara's mom]

I suppose that in extremely rare cases it could be possible. It would be the equivalent of a human being living to the age of 115 or more. It happens but, very seldom.

[CorkyMax]

There was (Prob. in Gueines (mispelled) Book of records--a dog that lived I think 27 or 29 yrs and think it was some kind of collie. Also in the news a while back (which I missed and my daughter told me about it)there is a cocker--still alive who is 22. I would love to know the background statistics on how they live---what they are/were fed--rabies and vac. shots--meds---Where the cocker lives, etc. I think it would be really interesting. And dogs are suppose to live about twice as long as they now do if they were 'treated' the right way!

[DoggieVogue]

The oldest dog in the guiness book of world records is only 21. The former one was 20. Both lived on crap commercial food. I haven't ever heard of a dog living to be more than that, no matter they ate.

[Yogi]

The worlds oldest living dog, Brambles old oldest animal guiness book of records
Oldest Dog 'Still Sprightly' at Almost 21 - Paw Nation
L.I. Dachshund Named 'World's Oldest Living Dog' - wcbstv.com
According to these links, The dog that lived to be the oldest died at 29. More recently one lived to be 27 with another at that time almost 27 and appears at this time the oldest living dog is 21 as of last month.
Note that one dog that lived to be 27 was fed no meat of any kind but was strictly fed veg diet. But then again I watched a 99 year old man who was interviewed a couple years back on a 10 foot ladder painting the trim of his house and he was a smoker for 70 some years and had a drink every evening. No explaining really why some live longer than others no matter what you do to your body.

[Todd]

Originally Posted by Yogi

The worlds oldest living dog, Brambles old oldest animal guiness book of records
Oldest Dog 'Still Sprightly' at Almost 21 - Paw Nation
L.I. Dachshund Named 'World's Oldest Living Dog' - wcbstv.com
According to these links, The dog that lived to be the oldest died at 29. More recently one lived to be 27 with another at that time almost 27 and appears at this time the oldest living dog is 21 as of last month.
Note that one dog that lived to be 27 was fed no meat of any kind but was strictly fed veg diet. But then again I watched a 99 year old man who was interviewed a couple years back on a 10 foot ladder painting the trim of his house and he was a smoker for 70 some years and had a drink every evening. No explaining really why some live longer than others no matter what you do to your body.

Well the pattern I do see is that these record breaking dogs were not fed kibble. They were not fed processed foods but fresh foods. But you're right, some people and dogs get lucky. Guess it could also be attributed to genetics.

[Lara's mom]

I only wish that it was possible for most dogs. I'd give anything and everything I own to have those extra years with my little pack!

[Yogi]

[QUOTE=Todd;83129]Well the pattern I do see is that these record breaking dogs were not fed kibble. They were not fed processed foods but fresh foods. But you're right, some people and dogs get lucky. Guess it could also be attributed to genetics.[/QUOTE

to note, they also ate no bones, no tripe, no beef no fish etc and no raw diet outside of the cooked vegetables.

[Todd]

[quote=Yogi;83193]

Originally Posted by Todd

Well the pattern I do see is that these record breaking dogs were not fed kibble. They were not fed processed foods but fresh foods. But you're right, some people and dogs get lucky. Guess it could also be attributed to genetics.[/QUOTE

to note, they also ate no bones, no tripe, no beef no fish etc and no raw diet outside of the cooked vegetables.

Yes I know they didn't eat a raw diet. I'm just pointing out the fact that they didn't eat kibble, which most dogs that don't live half that long do. If diet had nothing to do with it at least one of those record breaking dogs would have been on kibble.

[CorkyMax]

Originally Posted by Yogi

The worlds oldest living dog, Brambles old oldest animal guiness book of records
Oldest Dog 'Still Sprightly' at Almost 21 - Paw Nation
L.I. Dachshund Named 'World's Oldest Living Dog' - wcbstv.com
According to these links, The dog that lived to be the oldest died at 29. More recently one lived to be 27 with another at that time almost 27 and appears at this time the oldest living dog is 21 as of last month. Hey-Yog--What about the cocker who is 22 that was on tv a couple months back--Wish I hadn't missed that!
Note that one dog that lived to be 27 was fed no meat of any kind but was strictly fed veg diet.Wonder if it had all those vac--esp. the Rabies? But then again I watched a 99 year old man who was interviewed a couple years back on a 10 foot ladder painting the trim of his house and he was a smoker for 70 some years and had a drink every evening. No explaining really why some live longer than others no matter what you do to your body.

Sorry, I should check the links you gave--maybe some of my questions will be answered!

Just checked the links--interesting but did't answer many of my questions. Wonder what the laws are in England and Australia pertaining to rabies vaccinations. Wonder why the 22 yr. old cocker isn't considered the oldest now instead of the 21 yr. old dog they are saying is? Maybe the owners of the cocker need to lay claim to this 'title.' You'd think it would be 'documented/whatever' as was on tv, so well known about.

[Lara's mom]

Originally Posted by DoggieVogue

The oldest dog in the guiness book of world records is only 21. The former one was 20. Both lived on crap commercial food. I haven't ever heard of a dog living to be more than that, no matter they ate.

I don't know where you got the idea that none of these dogs ate kibble...

[DoggieVogue]

Originally Posted by Lara's mom

I don't know where you got the idea that none of these dogs ate kibble...

No, I said they did eat kibble, poor quality at that. I read an article about the two of them a while back. The writer asked them what they did different, that made their dogs live so long. When asked about diet, both of their owners said they were just regular dogs, got no special foods or treats, just run of the mill grocery store food and treats. They just got lucky I guess. I would give anything to lengthen my pup's life! My point pretty much was that despite our best efforts, some dogs just live longer than others. My great grandmother lived to be 99 and she smoked like a broken stove and ate bacon everyday along with other fried garbage food. She was never sick a day in her life until she got in her late 90's. I guess its just that way with some dogs too.

[Yogi]

[quote=Todd;83199]

Originally Posted by Yogi

Yes I know they didn't eat a raw diet. I'm just pointing out the fact that they didn't eat kibble, which most dogs that don't live half that long do. If diet had nothing to do with it at least one of those record breaking dogs would have been on kibble.

I don't know about that, Rumba my oldest Miniature Pinscher was 19 when he passed on. He was on kibble and dry his whole life. Average life span of a Miniature Pinscher is 12 to 14 years. Abbey was 16, Ole Jack was 17, Thor my Mal/Wolf was 16 Niki my Shep/Husky was 15 1/2.. all lived long beyond their average life span. There is far more involved in longevity than diet. As I pointed out, they interviewed a 99 year active senior who smoked. He had for some 70 years and drank every night and yet he was out on a ladder painting his house.
His diet was anything he wanted to eat. Nothing in particular. Fact is, there is nothing that supports dogs living longer necessarily based on diet only opinions and speculation. Granted, common sense does indicate that if it is better it must therefore be better for you but for everyone that eats this way, there are as many who do not an live just as long or longer. I am reminded of the number of professional athletes that eat very healthy but succumb to diseases just as easily and as often as those who do not. Professional body builders who are clean of steroids that die by age 65 or 70 when others who do not take care of their bodies live far beyond. There is no proof that anything actually works otherwise by now we would all be living long lives and it just does not happen. This same philosophy goes for dogs when it comes to believing that diet is the sole reason for long life when in fact it does not come close to the reason one dog lives longer than another. My grandmother passed away at 92 from a brain tumor left undiagnosed after hitting her head on the night table in her bedroom. Her grandmother lived to be 102. Her mother was in her late 90's when she passed on yet my mother died when she was 62. All shared the same, drinking and eating habits. General health issues, whether injuries or mental such as stress, account for more reasons for shortened life than diet. As the one owner noted, they did nothing special regarding diet and most likely put no undue stress on the dog such as over training. Mine have lived this long because they are allowed to be what they are, dogs. I don't dolt on them. I don't spoil them and do not force my attention on them. They get what they want when they want or need it. My rescues who come here confused or with issues are granted the time to come to me, not me to them. With this I have seen very good results in their attitude and demeanor. They revert back to being content with themselves to the point of playful with me and the other dogs. All while feeding the same thing the others get and with no undue stress. The unfortunate thing is that so many assume that diet is the all encompassing cure to everything when it simply is not. The makeup of dogs like people is far more complicated for anyone to assume that changing a diet will resolve the mystery as to longevity in dogs. As clearly documented by the owners of these dogs.

[Todd]

[quote=Yogi;83252]

Originally Posted by Todd

I don't know about that, Rumba my oldest Miniature Pinscher was 19 when he passed on. He was on kibble and dry his whole life. Average life span of a Miniature Pinscher is 12 to 14 years. Abbey was 16, Ole Jack was 17, Thor my Mal/Wolf was 16 Niki my Shep/Husky was 15 1/2.. all lived long beyond their average life span. There is far more involved in longevity than diet. As I pointed out, they interviewed a 99 year active senior who smoked. He had for some 70 years and drank every night and yet he was out on a ladder painting his house.
His diet was anything he wanted to eat. Nothing in particular. Fact is, there is nothing that supports dogs living longer necessarily based on diet only opinions and speculation. Granted, common sense does indicate that if it is better it must therefore be better for you but for everyone that eats this way, there are as many who do not an live just as long or longer. I am reminded of the number of professional athletes that eat very healthy but succumb to diseases just as easily and as often as those who do not. Professional body builders who are clean of steroids that die by age 65 or 70 when others who do not take care of their bodies live far beyond. There is no proof that anything actually works otherwise by now we would all be living long lives and it just does not happen. This same philosophy goes for dogs when it comes to believing that diet is the sole reason for long life when in fact it does not come close to the reason one dog lives longer than another. My grandmother passed away at 92 from a brain tumor left undiagnosed after hitting her head on the night table in her bedroom. Her grandmother lived to be 102. Her mother was in her late 90's when she passed on yet my mother died when she was 62. All shared the same, drinking and eating habits. General health issues, whether injuries or mental such as stress, account for more reasons for shortened life than diet. As the one owner noted, they did nothing special regarding diet and most likely put no undue stress on the dog such as over training. Mine have lived this long because they are allowed to be what they are, dogs. I don't dolt on them. I don't spoil them and do not force my attention on them. They get what they want when they want or need it. My rescues who come here confused or with issues are granted the time to come to me, not me to them. With this I have seen very good results in their attitude and demeanor. They revert back to being content with themselves to the point of playful with me and the other dogs. All while feeding the same thing the others get and with no undue stress. The unfortunate thing is that so many assume that diet is the all encompassing cure to everything when it simply is not. The makeup of dogs like people is far more complicated for anyone to assume that changing a diet will resolve the mystery as to longevity in dogs. As clearly documented by the owners of these dogs.

All I'm saying is I've read about a few record breaking dogs who lived in their late twenties and they both were on a homemade diet not kibble. Again, this si just from the articles I have read/the cases I have heard of. I know for a fact that Bluey I believe who lived for 29 or so years was on a homemade diet.

Genetics do play a huge role in lifespan however I firmly believe that diet does as well. I mean come on. If you ate fast food every day you would be very likely to contract some sort of disease or terminal illness/organ failure because of colestrol levels, blood pressure, etc.

Originally Posted by Lara's mom

I don't know where you got the idea that none of these dogs ate kibble...

From the cases I have personally read about the dogs were not on regular kibble. They were on homemade diets. Again, only the articles I have prsonally read about the oldest dogs on record.

[Lara's mom]

My apologies. That post was meant for Todd.

[CorkyMax]

Originally Posted by DoggieVogue

No, I said they did eat kibble, poor quality at that. I read an article about the two of them a while back. The writer asked them what they did different, that made their dogs live so long. When asked about diet, both of their owners said they were just regular dogs, got no special foods or treats, just run of the mill grocery store food and treats. They just got lucky I guess. I would give anything to lengthen my pup's life! My point pretty much was that despite our best efforts, some dogs just live longer than others. My great grandmother lived to be 99 and she smoked like a broken stove and ate bacon everyday along with other fried garbage food. She was never sick a day in her life until she got in her late 90's. I guess its just that way with some dogs too.

Are you basing your comment--I said they did eat kibble--on this comment you also gave above: just run of the mill grocery store food and treats. This sounds to me like human food---There is no mention here of dog food !!??

[Todd]

Originally Posted by Corky/Max

Are you basing your comment--I said they did eat kibble--on this comment you also gave above: just run of the mill grocery store food and treats. This sounds to me like human food---There is no mention here of dog food !!??

By the way DoggieVouge, could you give me the link to the record age breaking dog who was said to have eaten regular kibble?

[Yogi]

the key phrase is "you would very likely"..the fact is, there is no way to prove or has it been proven so. It is only an assumption. As with people, dogs are all different therefore assuming that what is good for one is good for all would be naive. I do not know about you but I cannot eat most Mexican foods, nor East Indian foods. It is like trying to tell everyone that if you can eat, then you can eat anything and expecting it to be so when in fact that is not how it works. Like people, dogs become acclimated to foods they are use to and there is nothing wrong with that. But to always assume that diet is the emphasis to sell your raw diet philosophy starts to appear as if that is all encompassing to you and it should not be. There is far more to dog ownership and responsibility than pushing raw diets as the solution to every person who comes here asking questions that in the OP's post did not mention or state anything what so ever to do with feeding their dog. You have linked it to behavior issues and to training issues from what I have seen and cannot understand how the topic went from asking why a dog does this or that to you should look at feeding your dog raw diet or changing up its food. If the OP never asked then why the push? It only continues to create the animosity that occurred previously. Staying on topic with regards to the OP is the object. Offering advice based on experience and actual fact is helpful, speculation should always be second guessed and taken for what it is. Not sure but also could be. Then pointed out in this manner so that the OP can see all aspects of their original question and not be confused or led to believe that now in addition to having problems with their dog when they came here that did not include feeding, they now are being told what they feed is also a problem when it is not. Todd, the goal here is to offer advice based on the OP's question. If they ask about what to feed, feel free to chime in. If they do not, then we do not expect it to be part of the answer or reply. Accept the fact that you may raw feed but this in no way entitles you to go on about what we elect to feed as being bad when it has proven successful. You noted on one post that Science Diet takes longer to process. You have never actually used it yourself yet I have and for a fact, you were wrong. I have used several different Science Diet foods for rescues that have come to me from overweight to diabetes and they worked extremely well. It seems like one way or another all you want to do here is promote raw feeding which is your choice but does not give you the right to endorse and at the same time slam what you honestly do not know but only assume. As I have stated, so far there is no proof that raw is better, none. it has not been around long enough for a proper study to determine. For your sake I hope when the study is done and completed, it turns out that it is in fact as healthy as you believe it is. But in the interim, the dog foods I have used for years which is probably longer than you have been alive have in fact worked for my dogs all of them and of those bred by me, they have lived far beyond their breed standards. Based on the food I give them, the way they are raised, their mental health and the yearly check ups coming back as all very healthy there is nothing you have that can prove this wrong.
Accept to continue to verbally denounce what you do not know for a fact but take from the web which is primarily based solely on opinions of people like yourself that want to believe only what they want to based on what they hear and actually not see. I have always been one to let people feed what they want to their dogs as it is not my place to preach and I do not expect nor appreciate anyone else feeling they have the right to preach to me.
Advice here is based on either fact or from experience. That is what people come here for. If you have nothing in these regards to post under a specific topic than it is left to assumption. In which case you may be offering the wrong advice which can be more detrimental than helpful. This is something that each of us has to determine before we randomly decide to reply. It is common sense and should be observed by all here to ensure we are in fact helping the OP with their actual concern. I think you understand this and show this in most of your replies. So based on that, keep up the good work.
Your input on these topics is appreciated.

[Todd]

Originally Posted by Yogi

the key phrase is "you would very likely"..the fact is, there is no way to prove or has it been proven so. It is only an assumption. As with people, dogs are all different therefore assuming that what is good for one is good for all would be naive. I do not know about you but I cannot eat most Mexican foods, nor East Indian foods. It is like trying to tell everyone that if you can eat, then you can eat anything and expecting it to be so when in fact that is not how it works. Like people, dogs become acclimated to foods they are use to and there is nothing wrong with that. But to always assume that diet is the emphasis to sell your raw diet philosophy starts to appear as if that is all encompassing to you and it should not be. There is far more to dog ownership and responsibility than pushing raw diets as the solution to every person who comes here asking questions that in the OP's post did not mention or state anything what so ever to do with feeding their dog. You have linked it to behavior issues and to training issues from what I have seen and cannot understand how the topic went from asking why a dog does this or that to you should look at feeding your dog raw diet or changing up its food. If the OP never asked then why the push? It only continues to create the animosity that occurred previously. Staying on topic with regards to the OP is the object. Offering advice based on experience and actual fact is helpful, speculation should always be second guessed and taken for what it is. Not sure but also could be. Then pointed out in this manner so that the OP can see all aspects of their original question and not be confused or led to believe that now in addition to having problems with their dog when they came here that did not include feeding, they now are being told what they feed is also a problem when it is not. Todd, the goal here is to offer advice based on the OP's question. If they ask about what to feed, feel free to chime in. If they do not, then we do not expect it to be part of the answer or reply. Accept the fact that you may raw feed but this in no way entitles you to go on about what we elect to feed as being bad when it has proven successful. You noted on one post that Science Diet takes longer to process. You have never actually used it yourself yet I have and for a fact, you were wrong. I have used several different Science Diet foods for rescues that have come to me from overweight to diabetes and they worked extremely well. It seems like one way or another all you want to do here is promote raw feeding which is your choice but does not give you the right to endorse and at the same time slam what you honestly do not know but only assume. As I have stated, so far there is no proof that raw is better, none. it has not been around long enough for a proper study to determine. For your sake I hope when the study is done and completed, it turns out that it is in fact as healthy as you believe it is. But in the interim, the dog foods I have used for years which is probably longer than you have been alive have in fact worked for my dogs all of them and of those bred by me, they have lived far beyond their breed standards. Based on the food I give them, the way they are raised, their mental health and the yearly check ups coming back as all very healthy there is nothing you have that can prove this wrong.
Accept to continue to verbally denounce what you do not know for a fact but take from the web which is primarily based solely on opinions of people like yourself that want to believe only what they want to based on what they hear and actually not see. I have always been one to let people feed what they want to their dogs as it is not my place to preach and I do not expect nor appreciate anyone else feeling they have the right to preach to me.
Advice here is based on either fact or from experience. That is what people come here for. If you have nothing in these regards to post under a specific topic than it is left to assumption. In which case you may be offering the wrong advice which can be more detrimental than helpful. This is something that each of us has to determine before we randomly decide to reply. It is common sense and should be observed by all here to ensure we are in fact helping the OP with their actual concern. I think you understand this and show this in most of your replies. So based on that, keep up the good work.
Your input on these topics is appreciated.

I understand what you're saying, but I really don't feel as if I'm much wanted on this forum. No hard feelings, but I think I'll try another one. Sorry for anything I did or said that may have been innapropraite for the given situation. thanks.

Yogi, is there any way for me to delete my account? Thanks.

[Yogi]

Todd, let me reiterate, you are appreciated on this forum. You give good advice and I concur with most of your replies and have said so often. My concern is the emphasis on feeding and nutrition. You are bright and obviously passionate but with all things in life, you can achieve the end result you are looking for by staying on tract to earn more trust from those you give advice to. To concede is not going to accomplish what anyone feels compassionate about. It is more appropriate to look at other ways and avenues which I know you are capable of. If you still wish, I will comply with your request but if there is one thing I have learned in life, it is taking rash actions only lead to regret later.
Think about it for awhile before you commit to wanting me to take this action.
thank, Yogi