[Mehasmom]

Originally Posted by drdan1960

First of all, I'm sorry about the loss of your pet. Unfortunately, you don't really know what happened to your dog.

The human form of Proin, phenylpropanolamine, was taken off the market while I was in med school which was a bummer because it was a lot cheaper for me to buy it for my dog from the pharmacy. She has been on it for 11 years and is perfectly healthy.

The study which caused the FDA to place a black box warning on the human drug was published in the NEJM in the late 90s. It basically showed a very weak association (6/100,000) events of stroke and the study did not deal with some of the confounding variables. There was some political pressure (as there usually is....i.e., the morning after pill, bad data from the pharma companies about Vioxx, the lack of concern about BPA despite the fact that all the data that shows no harm is from the plastics industry and the independent studies show something different, but I digress) and a black box warning was issued. As the drug was generic, there was no incentive to continue making it. There are many of these examples.

I respect your decision, and I applaud the use of alternatives (although the side effects of some DES can be worse), but please understand the data before condemning the product. Anectodotal evidence is just that....ancedotal.

Best regards.

My dog just had a stroke and died, proin does kill.

[cherylmartin]

Mehasmom
First let me say how sorry I am for you loss. With Jasmine's 1 year mark tomorrow, it saddens me even more.

Please, I encourage you to: a) contact Pegasus Laboratories, via their web site, obtain a case number and do no let them convince you they will file with the FDA
b) file an adverse reaction report with the FDA
c) file a complaint with your State Board of Veterinary Medicine
d) tell all you know not to use this drug


Please come back and tell us more about what happened to your precious furbabay. I do care.

Hugs and my thoughts and prayers

[Washu]

I didn't read all the posts, only to page 8 or so.

I saw that a few posts people had their dogs on pretty high doses, 4x the dose I give my dog!! Some of these poor dogs are older, and given such a high dose of this medication proved to be lethal for them.

My 8 year old GSD has been on proin for 3 years. She is 70 lbs.
At first the vet told us to give her 50mg twice a day. She lost her appetite, and was anxious. I decided to see another vet. Our new vet told us to try 1/2 (25mg) a pill once a day. This worked like a charm, no more waking up in puddles, no anxiety, and great appetite.

[Mehasmom]

Originally Posted by Washu

I didn't read all the posts, only to page 8 or so.

I saw that a few posts people had their dogs on pretty high doses, 4x the dose I give my dog!! Some of these poor dogs are older, and given such a high dose of this medication proved to be lethal for them.

My 8 year old GSD has been on proin for 3 years. She is 70 lbs.
At first the vet told us to give her 50mg twice a day. She lost her appetite, and was anxious. I decided to see another vet. Our new vet told us to try 1/2 (25mg) a pill once a day. This worked like a charm, no more waking up in puddles, no anxiety, and great appetite.

I had my malamute dog of 85# on 50 mg a day and noticed no side effects from it until the day she died. My vet should have told me to at least wean her off the full dose. They told me to give her 1 1/2 a day but I never gave her more than 1. She only peed in her sleep a couple of times a month and probably didn't need that much.

[CorkyMax]

Washu! I hope you go back and read the rest of the posts in this thread! Your dog may (or may not!) be one of the lucky ones. I hope you get blood work done frequently to check the kidney and liver functions!It does appear to be a problem with the dosage--BUT---Who knows how much to give--It is like playing Russian Roulette with your dog's life! Many dogs have died because of the very 1st pill given! Not only the weight of the dog would 'enter in' to try to determine the dosage--But what shape the immune system is in -- And what if your dog gets sick/gets a disease and then for sure has a compromised immune system--Your dog could just drop over dead at any time! To me--This is a tragedy just waiting to happen---And if you read all the posts, you will see where some dogs have died from this crap after taking this for years! Could the immune system just quit trying to handle it--Did the dog get sick and couldn't take it anymore---Also you mention about older dogs being more susceptible---Is not your dog on this crap permanently!? Dosage would have to be lowered-YES!? Again it is a guess as to how long/how much your older dog can safely take.--And at a point in time--maybe no dosage is safe! NO THANKS--My dog(s) will never be on Proin no matter what!!!! I feel so bad for any dog that is on this crap!! :cry:

[Washu]

Originally Posted by Corky/Max

Washu! I hope you go back and read the rest of the posts in this thread! Your dog may (or may not!) be one of the lucky ones. I hope you get blood work done frequently to check the kidney and liver functions!It does appear to be a problem with the dosage--BUT---Who knows how much to give--It is like playing Russian Roulette with your dog's life! Many dogs have died because of the very 1st pill given! Not only the weight of the dog would 'enter in' to try to determine the dosage--But what shape the immune system is in -- And what if your dog gets sick/gets a disease and then for sure has a compromised immune system--Your dog could just drop over dead at any time! To me--This is a tragedy just waiting to happen---And if you read all the posts, you will see where some dogs have died from this crap after taking this for years! Could the immune system just quit trying to handle it--Did the dog get sick and couldn't take it anymore---Also you mention about older dogs being more susceptible---Is not your dog on this crap permanently!? Dosage would have to be lowered-YES!? Again it is a guess as to how long/how much your older dog can safely take.--And at a point in time--maybe no dosage is safe! NO THANKS--My dog(s) will never be on Proin no matter what!!!! I feel so bad for any dog that is on this crap!! :cry:

Thank you for your concern. My dog gets regular vet care. Just 2 weeks ago we had a blood panel drawn, and everything is normal. We go yearly for an annual exam, and every 6 months for a blood panel. I've tried to wean her off the Proin, and she started dripping urine while she walked around the house, and left a big puddle in her sleep.

[whitewolfe001]

A couple weeks ago our vet prescribed Proin for our 2.5 year old female lab who we had finally concluded was definitely 'leaking' when laying down relaxing or sleeping.

The first two days or so she seemed fine, although much less hyper than she usually is. The leaking stopped right away. So it seemed great - the medication was working, and I actually thought that she was calmer because she was feeling 'confident' and not worried about accidentally peeing.

Then the sickness started. One morning we awoke to find a big splat near the back door of what initially looked like vomit, but realized it was poo. The next night, we heard one of the dogs vomiting in our bedroom. We couldn't have been sure which dog it was. The third day, I found puke in her crate after we'd only been gone two hours, so I knew it was the female dog. I started looking up Proin online and didn't find any reference to vomiting as a side effect. But after a couple more days of finding either puke or splats of runny poop, I knew it had to be the medication, because this had never happened before. It became clear she was not 'calmer', but just feeling sick. She didn't want to play anymore and was iffy about finishing her meals (VERY unusual.) So I stopped giving it to her. The puking and diarrhea diminished over the next two days and then stopped.

So I mention it to the vet and they said they had never heard of such a reaction. We've started her on an herbal supplement (suo quan won) the last couple of days. It doesn't seem to be helping her leakage at all but we've started at a dose loser than recommended just to make sure she tolerates it; no bad side effects so far. We're going to gradually increase the dosage to the recommended level and give it a chance. If it doesn't work we're going to try some of the other natural products mentioned, like Leaks No More, or PetNaturals Bladder Support.

I also read somewhere that somebody cured their dog of incontinence by teaching it to wag its tail on command, which strengthened the muscles down there (like Kegels, I guess!) Interesting enough the female dog does not wag nearly as much as our other dog, so I bet it would help. I'm going to work on that too.

Reading the stuff here about Proin has been scary and I don't want to try it again. As a person who has suffered some weird side effects from prescription medication, I know full well that the 'statistically insignificant' effects CAN happen to you, and I myself have had great success with natural remedies. In the end I would rather deal with washing dog beds every day than lose my dog.

[Mehasmom]

Thanks for the email. Leaks no more is supposed to work good according to valley vet and is better for the dog. If only I knew this before she died. My vet still thinks it was a heart attack but I still think it was the proin. Her dog is on it too. I reported it to the FDA and to my vet because she was not cremated there. My vet never checked her blood pressure when I brought her in and never told me there were any side effects. If its not good for humans how can it be for dogs. Good Luck.

[judah]

My 2year old Dobie, Bella, was spayed in February. Just recently she began leaking while sleeping. She never has an accident while awake. My vet advised either Proin or hormones. I opted for the Proin, which was in retrospect a huge mistake. I gave her one pill (Proin 75) with her dinner. Within two hours she started growling. It was a low growl, which I had never heard before. She was restless and I could not get her to lie down. She was not growling at me but every time I tried to comfort her she would cry. My husband checked her heartbeat, compared to our 90lb male dobie and she was breathing twice as fast. I then found this website and I thought I would die. I was sure she was going to die during the night. I stayed up all night with her and thankfully she was fine in the morning. After reading all of the tips for natural cures (thanks to all who posted) I gave her soy milk and added ACV to her drinking water. In addition, I added fresh parsley to her dinner. This all transpired on Friday evening. Since I started using these natural products she has not leaked once. I cannot adequately express my thanks to the posters on this forum. I am grateful that my baby is now fine and express my sincere condolences to those who were not as fortunate.

[Mehasmom]

Originally Posted by judah

My 2year old Dobie, Bella, was spayed in February. Just recently she began leaking while sleeping. She never has an accident while awake. My vet advised either Proin or hormones. I opted for the Proin, which was in retrospect a huge mistake. I gave her one pill (Proin 75) with her dinner. Within two hours she started growling. It was a low growl, which I had never heard before. She was restless and I could not get her to lie down. She was not growling at me but every time I tried to comfort her she would cry. My husband checked her heartbeat, compared to our 90lb male dobie and she was breathing twice as fast. I then found this website and I thought I would die. I was sure she was going to die during the night. I stayed up all night with her and thankfully she was fine in the morning. After reading all of the tips for natural cures (thanks to all who posted) I gave her soy milk and added ACV to her drinking water. In addition, I added fresh parsley to her dinner. This all transpired on Friday evening. Since I started using these natural products she has not leaked once. I cannot adequately express my thanks to the posters on this forum. I am grateful that my baby is now fine and express my sincere condolences to those who were not as fortunate.

I am so glad that you stopped giving Proin to your dog. Someone also told me that Leaks No More works good too but I have not researched it. Proin should be taken off the market. Since a lot of older dogs take this medicine , the side effects and sudden death probably go overlooked as a stroke or heart attack. I didn't even think about Proin until I thought about giving it away to someone else who needed it. Then I saw these posts on here and realized that it may have caused Meha's death.

[Niki's mom]

Hi everyone. I have a 2-year-old female Siberian Husky. She has been on Proin for a month for urinary incontinence. My vet tried to give it to me a few months ago but I said "no" because her dripping at the time was more of a mucus like with a UTI. But since then she has had some urine drippage. She's been on it for a month and I haven't seen any drips, but she still licks the area a lot so I assume she's still dripping. I decided to do a little research and came across this page. I'm kind of angry at myself for not researching it before I gave it to her. The vet's plan was to have her on it for a month and see if it helps. I called the vet to ask her about these concerns on this page and she said it's one of the safest incontinence drugs and the only real concern is liver damage, which is why they do panels for dogs on it long-term. I asked if I could just stop the med because I'm not realy comfortable with it at this point and she said it's best to wean, but I don't want to give her any more at all. I just want to do what's best and safest for her, but it's so hard to tell. I just wish there were safe, natural cures for everything, but that's just wishful thinking!! But I know now that I need to research things, and I'm thankful that people post scary things like this to warn others. I'm sorry for anyone who has lost their dog because of something like this

[Mehasmom]

Originally Posted by Niki's mom

Hi everyone. I have a 2-year-old female Siberian Husky. She has been on Proin for a month for urinary incontinence. My vet tried to give it to me a few months ago but I said "no" because her dripping at the time was more of a mucus like with a UTI. But since then she has had some urine drippage. She's been on it for a month and I haven't seen any drips, but she still licks the area a lot so I assume she's still dripping. I decided to do a little research and came across this page. I'm kind of angry at myself for not researching it before I gave it to her. The vet's plan was to have her on it for a month and see if it helps. I called the vet to ask her about these concerns on this page and she said it's one of the safest incontinence drugs and the only real concern is liver damage, which is why they do panels for dogs on it long-term. I asked if I could just stop the med because I'm not realy comfortable with it at this point and she said it's best to wean, but I don't want to give her any more at all. I just want to do what's best and safest for her, but it's so hard to tell. I just wish there were safe, natural cures for everything, but that's just wishful thinking!! But I know now that I need to research things, and I'm thankful that people post scary things like this to warn others. I'm sorry for anyone who has lost their dog because of something like this

Hi,
I saw my vet yesterday and he thinks for the most part that proin is safe. But he also said,he couldn't tell me for sure if it caused my dog's death. I just think that since she had a stroke or heart attack after being on it two years, it could have been a leading cause of her death. She just collapsed and 15 minutes later died. No warning.
How much are you giving your dog? My dog was a siberian malamute mix. I gave her 1 a day but my vet told me to give her 1 1/2. If you keep giving this to your dog , I would just try giving her a 1/2 a day. If she is still leaking with the amount you are giving her, I would get a second opinion from another vet. Have you seen any other symptoms? Is she restless and excitable? Thats what a lot of people see in their dogs. I didn't notice that with my dog.
Some people also say that Leaks no more is a good alternative to proin. It just sounds strange to me that your dog is still licking. If the proin is working, she shouldn't be leaking. I hope you get something out of this post. i just posted it so people would be more aware of the medicine they give their dogs.

[Niki's mom]

She was on Proin 50, 1/2 tab every 8 hours. Her behavior didn't seem any different while she was on it, but it didn't seem to be helping much either since she was still licking herself down there a lot. But I didn't see any dripping, so it might've been helping a little. I gave it the full month like instructed, but don't want to give it any longer if it's not going to help, and a lot of this stuff that I've read has scared me. I had an amazing vet that I really trusted, and she was just awesome, but she moved and I don't necessarily care much for the other vets in that clinic. I need to find another vet that I really trust and that will actually take the time to talk through things with me. The other ones in that clinic seem so busy and just don't seem to give the same amount of time that my old vet did. I just want to do the right thing for my dog, so for now she's off the Proin since I gave the full month like instructed and we'll see if the incontinence starts to recur. At that point I will definitely seek another opinion. I was told the loose sphincter could allow bacteria back in and cause recurrent UTI's, which I definitely want to avoid, so I'm just going to keep an eye on things, do my research and hopefully find another great vet. Thanks for replying to my post.

[CorkyMax]

I realize that this is a long thread and takes time to go through it all. I know that there are quite a few suggestions on alternatives in this thread. I have never had a problem where I would be prescribed Proin and I know definitely my dog(s) will never be given this Proin crap no matter what!!!---So I can't say whether theses alternatives work---maybe some do for some dogs, but I sure would be trying them all before I would ever put my dog on Proin. And if none worked--I'd rather clean up after my dog than end up with a dead dog. Doggie diapers would be a last resort if nothing else worked!

[Niki's mom]

If it was just simply incontinence that I was dealing with I wouldn't care. I can handle that. What worries me are recurrent UTI's that could be caused by the sphincter problem. She's had 1 already that we've had to treat with antibiotics. I'm still not comfortable using Proin. I'm just hoping to find a healthy way to manage this. If anyone has a similar issue please let me know.

[HersheysMom]

Joined the group just so I could let others know about this product. My dog Sonie was on Proin due to spay incontinence. It got so bad at one point she would leak about half of the time she lay down. She was put on Proin. She was already a very nervous dog and I felt it made her more anxious. I started this supplement as I gradually decreased her Proin dosage over the course of a month. Now she is completely on this supplement and completely off of the Proin. Still no leaks, it works great!

Since I'm new it's not letting me post a link. But the product is called Senior Bladder Support by NaturVet It is widely available online and at Petco.

[OCS]

I'm so thankful I found this forum. Our otherwise very healthy 17 year old sheltie-mix was prescribed Proin last Saturday after a about a week or two of some incontinence. I live a few hours away from home, and my parents told me over the phone that after two doses (quarter tab each), she was acting abnormally-pacing, circling, having trouble walking and running into furniture, loss of appetite and loss of bladder and bowel control. She woujld get stuck in tight spots and bark and whine until she was helped out. They took her into the vet on Monday and the vet believed she suffered a stroke, but didn't believe it was due to the Proin. I came home for a visit and after seeing her alternate between pacing in circles and standing with her head in the corner, I started researching to see if there was anything we could do to help her. After seeing this, I have a hard time believing Proin did not play a part in her stroke. Since Saturday, her mobility has improved, and she will drink and take small amounts of food from us, but continues to pace constantly and is still incontinent. I am desperate to know from anyone who has experienced this if there is a chance of recovery from a reaction as serious as hers, and if the stroke was due to the Proin, if her treatment should be approached differently. I know all dogs are different, and we plan on contacting our vet again having learned what I have about Proin, but any advice would be so appreciated.

Sorry this was such a long post. I'm so grateful for all that I have learned from this thread already!

[Molly and Michaela's Mom]

My 11 year old Westie was put on Proin for dribbling. After just 4 days she started having problems much worse than the dribbling which has continued even when the vet said to increase the dose to 1/2 tablet twice a day. All she wants to do is sleep, drink, and go outside to urinate. If anything the medication seemed to make things worse so I took her off the Proin. She will sleep all day unless I make her get up, but at night she is a urinating machine. I am having to get up almost every hour to take her outside and even then she has accidents on the carpets. She drinks until she throws up unless I stand there and monitor her. I will NEVER put her or her 8 year old sister on this drug!
In addition to those problems she has started having problems seeing at night. Again she did not have this problem before the Proin. Sometimes her behavior is just really weird. I am so upset and worried that while I thought I was helping her I was really not.

[CorkyMax]

How long was she on Proin and how long has she been off of it?? I know that it could of damaged the liver or kidneys. Did your vet do blood work before prescribing this killer drug!!?? If the blood work is not good --Should never of been given Proin at all! I do not know your vet so have no idea if a good one or not--Although when it comes to prescribing Proin--Most vets will. My vet has it noted on my dogs records--No Rimadyl--no Proin and no prednisone without permission---And the only one I would consider permission for would be the prednisone after much thought by me!!

I don't know if it could cause diabetes (Prob. could--but a vet will not say that!!) May be other diseases, problems that could happen here too. I suggest to get blood work done and see what conditions the liver and the kidneys especially are in! If you don't think your vet is a good one--Find a dif. one---If this vet you have now--Did do blood work before prescribing Proin--Ask for copies of the blood work before and get copies of the new blood work you will have done now! Insist! You have a right to this info--After all you paid for it. Always get copies at all times--You can then see for yourself how things change as your dog gets older or also can see if things change from each time to alert you to possible upcoming problems to keep an eye on. You can show these copies (take with you) if you ever need to go to an emergency clinic or a dif. vet.

I hope you check the blood out and everything is okay--that there appears to be no damage done by the proin to the kidneys and liver. Keep us posted --We tend to worry about dogs here and want them to be healthy.

If you read all the many posts in this thread--You know that dogs had problems from this killer and lingered for many days after stopping the crap. It sounds to me that this crap may of done a number on your dog the way she is acting. I would have her checked out by a vet that is willing to listen to your concerns about Proin. Is there something that can be done after the fact---I don't know but I sure would try to find out---Blood work checking the liver and kidney functions is the place to start!!

[Molly and Michaela's Mom]

Thanks Corky/Max's Mom. No, no blood work was done. I live in a very small town and although I like one of the vets, the one I do not like saw Michaela. I am planning on getting her in to see the right vet this week and I will ask for a blood test. I am beginning to think that she developed diabetes and seeing problems from this drug since she had no problems before she started taking it in November of 2010. She has been off of it since last Friday and I will not ever be putting any of my dogs on this drug. Michaela is the third Westie that has owned me and the only one that developed the dribbling problem. I shared my early life with a I LOVE DOGS!I LOVE DOGS!I LOVE DOGS!I LOVE DOGS!-a-poo and she had the dribbles. I was living in Germany at the time the local vet wanted to put her down. I was livid at the suggestion. I just hope she has dribble problems in her old age!