[earlyshadowebony]

Hi everyone,

We have two females, ages 7 & 9, who both have occacional spay incontinence problems (not really a big problem, yet?). They are otherwise healthy, having just visited the vet for an annual check-up.

After mentioning the incontinence to our vet, she suggested we start them on Proin. The vet gave us a huge bottle of Proin 25 mg. (at a cost of $58.00) and told us to give them one pill three times a day. We gave them their first pill last evening with dinner (which they wanted to refuse), and another this morning, again not really wanting to take it. I believe they actually sense that it might not be good for them.

After reading these posts, I am not giving them any more! I am shocked and saddened to hear some of your stories and thank you for sharing this info with other dog owners.

We will report this info back to our vet, and advise her of our decision not to continue. Wanna bet she won't offer us a refund?

Meanwhile, we will try the soymilk or homeopathic products and see what happens. Washing a little bedding and mopping up the tile floors is not a problem if we can keep our girls healthy and happy.

Best wishes to all our fellow dog-lovers.

[Lara's mom]

Good luck trying to get a refund for those nasty pills! However, both of your dogs are alive and well. You can't put a price on that. A lot of others weren't as lucky. I'm just very glad that you saw this information before something tragic happened.

[cherylmartin]

earlyshadowebony,

I am so glad you found our posts on ProIn..

You have saved your precious furbabies lives!

When you do speak to your vet, ask them to be more responsible in handing out prescription drugs. Ask them to become more informed on adverse reactions to all drugs. Ask them to change their thinking and let us make an informed decision as to what our furbabies will and will not ingest.

By doing this, you can help save the life of another.

Cheryl and Angel Jasmine

[cherylmartin]

Yesterday I had a message from someone from Pegasus Labs and could not return the call. For some reason yesterday I was experincing Jasmine's last day all over again. The tears, hard to breathe. Maybe, unknowingly, I was anticipating their call for 2 weeks ago I had sent to the Board of Directors at Pegasus, all of Jasmine's medical records and enclosed pictures so they could look into her eyes and say they did nothing wrong.
I fear I know what their answer will be "ProIn did not kill Jasmine". But in reality, I know how Jasmine acted July 8, 2009 and I know the change in her July 9, 2009 after her first dose. It did kill her!
If Phenylpropanolamine is NOT approved by FDA for use in animals, they why are they permitted to use it? Can anyone answer that question?

Rest in Peace, my sweet baby girl for I will not until there are laws making Vets give us all the facts about side effects when writing out a prescription.

Cheryl and Angel Jasmine

[Mr. Vega]

Hey Cheryl, I never mentioned this before as I figured you already knew. A lot of pharmaceuticals used in veterinary medicine are used "off-label." Which, doesn't always make them bad, they just haven't be FDA approved for all the specific uses that are currently employed. There are many, many off label uses of drugs that have been wonderful, and, some that have been terrible as well.

[cherylmartin]

Yes Mr. Vega, in my research I found this out so what do you think of Diatro (Lomotil) which is also not approved by FDA which states in the "Plum" book I believe it is called, not to be given when in kidney failure!

[Lara's mom]

My heart just breaks for you and all the other members of the forum who have lost their beloved fur kids to this terrible drug. Being a life long dog parent, I too have lost many of my beloved babies although not in the tragic way that you did. I wish there were some words of comfort that I could offer you. However, I know from my own experience that there simply aren't any.

There are those in your life who will understand what you're going through or, at least try to. Others...well, what can I say. I remember sitting in a quiet corner of the park many years ago, crying after having to send my beloved dog to the Rainbow Bridge due to a massive stroke. A so-called "friend", happened along and asked me what was wrong so, I told him. I will never forget his response. He said, "It's too bad but, it's only a dog. You can always get another." It has been close to 20 years and, I've never been able to forgive him.

I honestly believe there is something very basic lacking in the humanity of people who have no compassion for animals and cannot understand the grief a dog parent experiences when they lose a beloved child. I hope that you have people in your life who understand the terrible grief you're going through and are being supportive in whatever way they can.

I also hope you know that we here in the forum share your grief. Every fur child is precious and the loss of every one leaves a hole in someone's heart.

May the Goddess bless both you and your darling Jasmine.

[cherylmartin]

Jasmine,

I found the courage to call back Pegasus Laboratories yesterday. The memories of your last 57 days with us came flooding back. The grief we have been suffering since 09-04-09 manifested itself once more for I had to speak your name out loud once again. The guilt I carry for giving you this medicine runs deep.
I knew what they would say," ProIn did not contribute to her death. There is no documented research that indicates ProIn neither does any harm nor kills.... It only stays in the system for 4 hours... We are pet lovers.......We can hear how much you cared for Jasmine.... (I firmly believe all this was a script she was reading). We treat all information from pet owners seriously....You sent no medical records for Jasmine when you changed Doctors. What did he say about ProIn? (Nothing, he was not going to discredit a fellow Doctor but he did bring out his Plum reference book and showed me where she should never have been given Diatro {Lomotil} for diarrhea). He did his very best to make her last days comfortable. Took her off all the meds, gave her pepto bismol to stop her diarrhea. And then I told her, we're not here to discuss the 'other vet'.
This scripted phone conversation went on for about 15 more minutes and then I was asked if I had anything further to say. Yes, as the manufacturer of this drug, you must make Vets better informed of adverse reactions to ProIn. Help make it mandatory that Vets tell us about adverse reactions. Allow us the right to make informed decisions about our pets health care.
We hear your voice...We hear Jasmine's voice...You sent your information to the Board of Directors and I have passed it along to them.... I then restated my never ending claim: I know how Jasmine was July 8, 2009 before this drug, I know how Jasmine was after her first dose July 9, 2009. We saw her die a slow death before our eyes.

I never expected them to say "Yes we agree. We killed her." I did however, expect, 'We'll research this drug further..."

She sounded like I was the only person who ever complained to them about this drug? Was she telling me that no one else had ever told them that ProIn kills? Has no one else had the courage to do this?

As I have quoted from the FDA website in all my recent posts: “If you do not file a complaint with the FDA...you're giving the manufacturer ammunition to use against you. They can claim there are so few cases of adverse reactions... nothing needs to be done. When you don't file, you stack the statistics in the manufacturers favor. Don't depend on your vet's office."

It’s never too late to do this. I really have never been the type of individual who complains but this drug, ProIn, helped kill my beloved Jasmine. I will not rest.

[CorkyMax]

Just found this in reference to reporting about NSAIDS and would include ways to report about Proin: Ten Steps to Take If You Suspect Your Dog Has Had an Adverse Reaction to Rimadyl

(1) If you see any of the above-listed signs of adverse reaction, immediately stop the drug and take your dog to the vet. The earlier your dog gets appropriate treatment, the better the chances of complete recovery.

(2) Have the vet do a blood panel and CBC (complete blood count). This will help your vet to determine the supportive therapy your dog needs.

(3) If your dog seems seriously ill, and you cannot get an immediate appointment with your vet, go to the nearest emergency veterinary clinic. Explain that you believe your dog is having a reaction that is typical of a dog taking a non-steroidal anti-inflammatory drug (NSAID). If the clinic staff is unfamiliar with the potential side effects of an NSAID like Rimadyl, have them refer to the Rimadyl product description or package insert. You can print one out from the Rimadyl website. Misdiagnosis is frequent in cases of a Rimadyl reaction. Don't accept a diagnosis of cancer, for example, until an adverse reaction to Rimadyl has been thoroughly ruled out.

(4) Call and have your veterinarian call Pfizer. The Pfizer staff veterinarians should be able to offer guidance to your veterinarian for the necessary tests and therapy your dog may need:

Pfizer: 1-800-366-5288

(5) If you have caught your dog's potential adverse reaction to Rimadyl in time, it is unlikely that the outcome will be fatal. Don't panic!

(6) If it becomes necessary to establish whether Rimadyl was a factor in a dog's death, a necropsy must be performed. The necropsy does NOT have to be done by a veterinarian appointed by Pfizer; it should, in fact, be done by an impartial third party. However, Pfizer should be advised promptly that the necropsy is being undertaken and that they will be entitled to some, but not all, of the tissue samples obtained.

(7) Try to maintain a diary of the events leading up to your dog's suspected adverse drug reaction. Make it as detailed as possible. Also obtain all medical records from all sources. Your diary and these records will be invaluable, should you decide to apply to Pfizer for reimbursement of veterinary medical expenses.

(8) Contact and have your veterinarian contact the FDA's Center for Veterinary Medicine to report the incident.

How to report to the FDA:

by telephone at: 1-888-332-8387 (or 1-888-FDA-VETS)
via the FDA website
or go directly to the form )
Once you print out the form, just complete it and mail it. It is postpaid.
According to the FDA:

"In common terms, an adverse drug experience (ADE) is either an undesired side effect, or the lack of a desired effect. The Center for Veterinary Medicine (CVM) defines an ADE as 'any side effect, injury, toxicity, or sensitivity reaction (or failure to perform as expected) associated with use of an animal drug, whether or not determined to be attributable to the drug.' " This means that you need only SUSPECT that the side effect is caused by the drug; you do not have to prove it.

If you decide to report an ADE , the FDA advises as follows:

"You should first call the drug company. Inform them that you wish to report an ADE, and ask to speak to a technical services veterinarian. The technical services veterinarian should ask a series of questions about the experience, complete a form called the FDA 1932, and forward the report to CVM . We suggest the drug company as your first point of contact because many companies will also offer clinical advice or diagnostic assistance. CVM does not provide these services. If you wish to confirm that your report was forwarded, or prefer not to call the drug company, call CVM directly at (888) FDA-VETS. Please ask to speak to one of the veterinarians responsible for the ADE monitoring program."



(9) The stress of dealing with your dog's illness may make it difficult for you to attend to the practical matters of reports, procedures, and bureaucratic requirements. If you feel you need assistance or guidance, please E-mail LuSwinton@aol.com.

(10) To aid your dog's recovery, in addition to enlisting the help of Pfizer and your veterinarian, you may wish to consider other options.

[cherylmartin]

corky/max

Thanks for providing all additional information, which I failed to do. I am waiting to hear from FDA, but I expect much of the same.

What also needs to be added is reporting this information to your State Doctors of Veterinary Medicine Board of Directors. We know the drug companies are not going to admit to anyone that ProIn (phenylpropanolamine), Rimadyl kills.

[CorkyMax]

I know this is getting confusing---May be dif labs to contact for Proin and Rimadyl-- but the guidelines to contact FDA would remain the same. Even so, it is good to remind people of the 'killer' Rimadyl also! And here are the symptoms that were mentioned above in other post to watch for and take action on for the Rimadyl.--- A Review of Signs of a Potentially Life-threatening Reaction to Rimadyl

loss of appetite
change in drinking habits (refusal to drink or increased water consumption)
unusual pattern of urination, blood in the urine, sweet-smelling urine, an overabundance of urine, urine accidents in the house
vomiting
diarrhea
black, tarry stools or flecks of blood in the vomit
lethargy, drowsiness, hyperactivity, restlessness, aggressiveness
staggering, stumbling, weakness or partial paralysis, full paralysis, seizures, dizziness, loss of balance
jaundice (yellowing of the skin, mucus membranes and whites of the eyes)

[cherylmartin]

corky/max

ProIn comes from Pegasus Laboratories in Fl. Rimadyl from Pfizer

[CorkyMax]

This is the link you have to go to in order to bring up the FORM mentioned about reporting the drug: http://www.srdogs.com/Pages/rimadyl.ade.steps.html

(Sorry about all the confusion--1 thing just kept leading to another!)

[cherylmartin]

For all of those who's furbaby was lost due to ProIn or had seizures or suffered some type of adverse side effect

I was just searching today and went to the PRN Pharmacal web site:
http://prnpharmacal.com/proin/index.php

After they tell the uneducated public how great their product is, they do not bother to tell about side effects, adverse reactions, do not take if...

How can they legally get away with this?

We must email them and let them know how wrong their advertising is-believe that is called 'false advertising'?

[CorkyMax]

I checked out the site mentioned above. There is a place to click to contact them. Phone # and EMAIL. I sent them this email:
I just read your advertisement on Proin-----Why do you not mention side effects!!!!! This killer of dogs should not even be on the market---It is killing dogs---Many dogs!!!!!!! Go to this site: Dog Forums - I-Love-Dogs - your Ultimate Dog Forum to get some information on this. Find the thread titled: Is Your Dog on Proin, Read This! This thread is in the Dog Health and Nutrition section/forum. How can you sleep at night?? You can come up with flimsy excuses on all this but we all know better!!! Greed-Greed-Greed and to he** with what happens to the dog!!!-- (Just came back in to 'modify' the he** word--Don't think it is allowed in this forum ---I did 'spell it out' though in my original email to that company!! Must have got through the 'filters' here because of it being a copy and paste thing!?? but thought I'd better 'change' it before the mods saw it and eliminate!)


Anyone else care to add their reply to this company? I am posting the page where it says how to contact them in the following post here----->

[CorkyMax]

Please send them your complaints!!

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

PRN Pharmacal
8809 Ely Road
Pensacola, FL 32514

Telephone
800.874.9764
850.476.9462

Facsimile
850.476.7087

Map & Directions



Email

Click on this site to be able to click on their email word to send them an email!

Be sure to mention the word Proin as they sell other things too!!

PRN Pharmacal

Lara's Mom has a better idea than the email to get better results!-----Copying and pasting her response she did in another thread on this (know you won't mind, Lara's Mom!)--I will be writing a letter. BTW, a hard copy letter carries a lot more weight than an email. I urge everyone in the forum to take a few minutes to write to this company.
__________________ Thanks for the good info, Lara's Mom!

[cherylmartin]

Well corky/max, seems we both overlooked something I find strange!!
At the very bottom of the website: Proin - PPA for Control of Urinary Incontinence in Dogs they state "A study published in Dansk Veterineartidsskriftl, a Danish journal-so why Denmark and not America? Something to hide and in searching the web, I found no study.

[CorkyMax]

Originally Posted by cherylmartin

Well corky/max, seems we both overlooked something I find strange!!
At the very bottom of the website: Proin - PPA for Control of Urinary Incontinence in Dogs they state "A study published in Dansk Veterineartidsskriftl, a Danish journal-so why Denmark and not America? Something to hide and in searching the web, I found no study.

Yes, this sounds 'not right'----We need to let them know and ask them about that too and maybe ask the FDA about it too---And bring it to their attention and tell them we want answers!! Also ask the FDA why this killer is still on the market and please DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT BEFORE MORE OF OUR INNOCENT DOGS DIE/ARE MURDERED!!!

[cherylmartin]

I did ask Mr Vega to reply since he is our VIT

[cherylmartin]

I emailed the page from the PRN website, to the CVM at the FDA and wonders of wonders. I received an answer back yesterday:

Dear Cheryl:

Thank you for sharing this information with us. I have forwarded it to our Office of Surveillance and Compliance for their review.

Sincerely,

CVM Home Page


We will just have to wait and see what develops!

Cheryl and Angel Jasmine