OK, here's the problem I have. Hair is dead. It has no blood supply, no nerves, it's as dead as a toe nail. The only place there is any blood supply is at the very base of the follicles, where new hair is produced. Once the hair emerges above the skin, the only thing that's going to have an effect on it is topical applications of conditioner. So how could a raw diet produce such a dramatic effect in only two weeks? The pup did not grow a whole new coat in two weeks!

Personally, I will never feed my dog raw meat. It's not safe for me to eat raw meat, and I certainly am not going to feed my dog foods that aren't safe for me to eat.

Don't be fooled. Dogs can and do get salmonella, campylobacter, e-coli, and a host of parasitic diseases from eating raw meat.

And don't be fooled by the claims that it's the natural diet of wild canids, either. Wild dogs and wolves don't live very long.

[Corky/Max]

Originally Posted by vetgroomer

OK, here's the problem I have. Hair is dead. It has no blood supply, no nerves, it's as dead as a toe nail. The only place there is any blood supply is at the very base of the follicles, where new hair is produced. Once the hair emerges above the skin, the only thing that's going to have an effect on it is topical applications of conditioner. So how could a raw diet produce such a dramatic effect in only two weeks? The pup did not grow a whole new coat in two weeks!

Personally, I will never feed my dog raw meat. It's not safe for me to eat raw meat, and I certainly am not going to feed my dog foods that aren't safe for me to eat.

Don't be fooled. Dogs can and do get salmonella, campylobacter, e-coli, and a host of parasitic diseases from eating raw meat.

And don't be fooled by the claims that it's the natural diet of wild canids, either. Wild dogs and wolves don't live very long.

I do not wish to get into another 'session' about the raw diet being good or bad---like the session a while back!! And I don't know why the coat looks better after only 2 wks but I do know when that new coat does come in, If you are feeding raw right, it does make a better, healthier coat---I have my 2 dogs as proof of that!! And the person who is getting a schnauzer will benefit even more because a schnauzer is prone to a lot of allergies and being able to control the diet (like not using grains) will help in this area too! Another reason for a better coat is feeding some raw egg also. As far as feeding raw not being safe--If the dog is healthy it should not have problems (Of course there are exceptions--but how many!!?? and how do you know how healthy the immune system was at the time)? And like I said before raw is prob. safer than the crap that is sold as most commercial dog foods---I mentioned all the salmonella that was found in this stuff---moldy grains have been found also as well as other bad stuff(some pretty deadly too and some dogs have died because of it!!) Then there are all the animals that have died from kidney failure this past year or so--esp. cats, but many dogs too.---from the 'poison' that got put in so much dog food and there have been a lot of recalls on many brands. You do not know what is in the commercial dog food being sold. It all goes back to greed on the part of the manufacturers--You can not trust them--They do not care about your dog, period!! They (most of them) are only empty calories with no nutrition to keep your dog healthy---After so many years of eating this crap--the immune system has been compromised and the dog starts 'shutting down'--gets sick--gets diseases---liver goes bad as well as kidneys (over-taxed). Some dogs even get so they won't eat this crap after a while--not getting any satisfaction from it!! And it has been stated that a dog should live about 10 more years then they do--and it all started with the selling of crappy dogfood!! And wild dogs and wolves die young from many causes!! I have one question for you Vetgroomer (make that 2) What kind of dog food is sold at the vet's office where you do your grooming? And have you read the facts that have been proven about what all is in this commercial dogfood? You have your opinions and I have mine and I do not wish to 'fight' with you!!

I'm not trying to fight with anyone. I just have my own opinion, based on what I've observed over the years.

To answer your questions, we sell I-Vet foods. And we've researched this food what it contains and more importantly what it doesn't contain.

I've read a great deal of conflicting "facts" about what has been "proven" to be contained in commercial dog foods. Just because someone writes something down in a book or on a web site does not make it true. One has to dig a bit deeper if one wants the "facts."

There's also another alternative to feeding raw meat if you don't want to feed commercial dog foods. Cook it.

[chevy & karen]

Up until 2005 I did'nt know anything about pet food. I was feeding Beneful, pupperoni's and other grocery store crap with topping's (human food on top). I did'nt even know there were other kind's of pet food. Once I started chevy on raw food I did see alot of change's, especially in his hair, teeth and ear problem's. I can't explain it but it did'nt take long at all for his hair to look very healthy.

Anyway, chevy was 5 at the time and he was'nt crazy about the raw food at all. He would only eat Shelton's Free Range raw ground turkey and the chicken neck's I would have to disguise for him to eat them and usually found part's of them laying around the house. His Holistic vet kept pushing me to make him get use to it and we kept at it for the better part of a year. Then I stopped the raw bone part of the diet because he just did'nt like it. The Holistic was ok with me giving him the raw ground turkey mixed with Wellness dry food so we stayed there for awhile.

Now chev is 9 year's old and he will still eat the raw ground turkey from time to time but I cook for him now. He want's his food cooked so I usually cook something big for him the beginning of the week ( chicken breast's, turkey breast's, roast beef, etc.) and it last's most of the week. His veggies are still raw (grated and mixed in his food) and he still get's some Wellness mixed in.

I don't know. Maybe chevy was just too old and set in his way's when we started the raw, he will still eat the raw shelton's but that's it and I just can't force it on him.

Anyway, back to the hair. I can't explain it but it did look good and it happened very fast. I hate to think of chevy not ever being here but maybe with my next pup I will have better luck with the raw.

Oh, his hair still look's ok, but it looked better when he was eating the raw only diet, and his teeth are still good, when he started the raw he had peridontal disease and lost his four front top teeth, between the raw food and some homeopathic remedies the peridontal disease was cured but the ear problem's come back from time to time. I treat them with Homeopathic medicine, but he love's to eat and he just does'nt want the raw and at this stage of his life I just want him to be happy. So that's my take on the raw. Physically he did very well on it but he just did'nt like it.

[Corky/Max]

Originally Posted by vetgroomer

I'm not trying to fight with anyone. I just have my own opinion, based on what I've observed over the years.

To answer your questions, we sell I-Vet foods. And we've researched this food what it contains and more importantly what it doesn't contain.

I've read a great deal of conflicting "facts" about what has been "proven" to be contained in commercial dog foods. Just because someone writes something down in a book or on a web site does not make it true. One has to dig a bit deeper if one wants the "facts."

There's also another alternative to feeding raw meat if you don't want to feed commercial dog foods. Cook it.

Coincidents are happening to me 'right regularly' lately! 1st off this morning I went into my emails to see if any new posts to the posts I have posted to---and to be honest, Vetgroomer, I had myself kind of braced 'cause I knew there would be a reply from you and I was kind of dreading it--but you somewhat surprised me! (nicely) I saw what you had posted and was going to get to a reply but figured I might as well look at all my new emails 1st. The coincident: I get a newsletter from Happy Healthy Dogs/Brigitte Smith. This time the main subject was supplements and she gave a link to a Dr. Andrew Jones DVM who of course is selling supplements, but he also offered a free download of a special report on Dog Food. I downloaded it and there are a lot of interesting things---and not just on dog food--and I think he is a holistic vet (from the way the report mentioned a lot of things), and if I recall right did not even mention raw food but seemed to be for home-cooked food for the dog. Wish you would see this report as I think you might get something out of it---as I said not all about dog food in general. Now--I am not good at all the 'good/easier things you can do with your computer---so here I am (hours) handcopying as much as I can. There are 42 pgs. It is suppose to be emailable but don't trust it to work--It is in the adobe mode w/the 'handgrabbing kind of curser' and I've had problems with this kind of 'set-up' before in trying to copy it. If anyone wants me to try and email it--I would need your email address and it is long-42 pgs (Just so you know!)
And/or I can give this to put in your browser. Like I said, I'm not good at some of this computer 'stuff' and think you will have to try to find the right place to get this download amongst this link: Dr. Jones' Ultimate Canine Health Formula: Nutritional Supplement For Dogs
another address given that might bring you to finding this report (ebook) is:
http://www.the dogsupplement.com/subscribeduch/ Hope it works!

I do plan on posting some of the hand-copied 'stuff'--Lol--didn't copy this all by hand not to use some of it! One thing mentioned : 150 brands of pet food was recalled in that 1997 big mess. And darn--thought I had copied on how many dogs had died because of that poisoned deal that shut down their kidneys----well if you find the ebook you can check it out.

About home-cooked: I use to feed cooked and think it is the next best to raw. I had a tendency (and afraid a lot of people prob. do this too) to feed too much carbs. and grains, esp. rice (brown rice, mind you!) It bulked up the meal and was cheaper to add too damn much of this pretty useless grain--but it added volume and calories!! Not good to add so much carbs--Diabetes
(which I myself have) for one thing. I've learned much since those days so prob. wouldn't do that again and I may end up going back to home-cooked. My dogs are getting older (10 and 11--old for cocker spaniels--life expectency--( At least these days) for them is about 14 yrs. BUT NOT UNTIL (IF) I FEEL I NEED TO. But if I think they could handle the warm and easier to chew cooked foods--may do it later.

Vetgroomer, you see a lot of dog's coats in your grooming--You must see coats that are better than others. It would be interesting to do a survey of sorts and ask what your clients feed, including if they supplement in any way and exactly what those supplements are, etc.

[chevy & karen]

Vetgroomer, you see a lot of dog's coats in your grooming--You must see coats that are better than others. It would be interesting to do a survey of sorts and ask what your clients feed, including if they supplement in any way and exactly what those supplements are, etc.[/QUOTE]

As one who went from junk to raw to home cooked with little raw I would be interested also and even more than that. I'm a cocker owner also and would really like to know about the cocker's with ear issues as to what they are fed, raw, commercial or home prepared.

Corky/Max if your cocker's have no ear issues on their diet I would think about switching off of it..

[Corky/Max]

Originally Posted by chevy & karen

Vetgroomer, you see a lot of dog's coats in your grooming--You must see coats that are better than others. It would be interesting to do a survey of sorts and ask what your clients feed, including if they supplement in any way and exactly what those supplements are, etc.

As one who went from junk to raw to home cooked with little raw I would be interested also and even more than that. I'm a cocker owner also and would really like to know about the cocker's with ear issues as to what they are fed, raw, commercial or home prepared.

Corky/Max if your cocker's have no ear issues on their diet I would think about switching off of it..[/QUOTE]

Sorry Karen--not sure I understand about the ear issues and switching diets??

[chevy & karen]

corky and max must not have them, I'm happy for you. They itch him at time's terribly and are very red and waxy.. I can clear them up but it never fails, it alway's comes back.

[Corky/Max]

Originally Posted by chevy & karen

corky and max must not have them, I'm happy for you. They itch him at time's terribly and are very red and waxy.. I can clear them up but it never fails, it alway's comes back.

Sorry I still don't get it--the way I am interpretting
is that if they have ear problems I should get off the raw diet
BUT they do get ear problems---mainly because cockers are prone because of the long floppy ears that for one thing , don't get enough air--nice moist environment for problems! I have used Mometamax (prescription only) on Corky (the mixed breed) but Max has had his problems too. I don't like using the Mometamax as it has ingredients that aren't good for the dog. But if it is the type of infection--fungal and whatever--prob. won't go away unless you use it. And I have had it come back too. If it is mites or just need to keep cleaning ears to try to avoid bigger problems---Vet actually gave me a home remedy-equal parts of white vinegar, water and rubbing alcohol, but if ears are sore from scratching, etc. another vet LOL, same office, said to only use 1 part vinegar to 2 parts water as the vinegar and alcohol would hurt because of the soreness. I got a couple of 'droppers'--nice size, free from the pharmacy at Walmart that I fill from a small glass bottle that I store the mixture in--don't like plastic because of the vinegar maybe leeching bad stuff from the plastic---wouldn't you think it could?--Won't buy vinegar in mostly what they sell plastic bottles either! And some ear problems are caused by allergies too--never really checked out this to see if it could be a problem with my 2 dogs.
Came back in here to add---You should use this home remedy a couple time a week to clean their ears---to try and keep 'things' from starting up! Just fill up the ear with the dropper---Don't let dog shake his head yet! After adding the solution--rub ear good to distribute the solution down in good. After dog shakes head a few times---wipe (tissue or cotton ball) anything that he may of shaken lose from his inner ear flap.

[chevy & karen]

Originally Posted by Corky/Max

Sorry I still don't get it--the way I am interpretting
is that if they have ear problems I should get off the raw diet
BUT they do get ear problems---mainly because cockers are prone because of the long floppy ears that for one thing , don't get enough air--nice moist environment for problems! I have used Mometamax (prescription only) on Corky (the mixed breed) but Max has had his problems too. I don't like using the Mometamax as it has ingredients that aren't good for the dog. But if it is the type of infection--fungal and whatever--prob. won't go away unless you use it. And I have had it come back too. If it is mites or just need to keep cleaning ears to try to avoid bigger problems---Vet actually gave me a home remedy-equal parts of white vinegar, water and rubbing alcohol, but if ears are sore from scratching, etc. another vet LOL, same office, said to only use 1 part vinegar to 2 parts water as the vinegar and alcohol would hurt because of the soreness. I got a couple of 'droppers'--nice size, free from the pharmacy at Walmart that I fill from a small glass bottle that I store the mixture in--don't like plastic because of the vinegar maybe leeching bad stuff from the plastic---wouldn't you think it could?--Won't buy vinegar in mostly what they sell plastic bottles either! And some ear problems are caused by allergies too--never really checked out this to see if it could be a problem with my 2 dogs.

I did'nt have ear issue's with chev when he was on his raw diet, is what I meant. Sorry, did'nt mean to confuse. I tried about everything there is for them but seem to have the best luck with the Homeopathic remedy Sulphur and bathing them in a solution of Hypercal and distilled water.. Even just the Calendula and distilled water mixed will soothe them tremendously...

But no no, the raw diet actually helped chev's ear's... Now that he's off it or almost off it, it's back to ear issue's again.