[Alex]

I really need some help! We have a German Shepherd (Zack) and a Bernese Mountain Dog (Ella), they're both a year and half old.

Zack was doing just fine til we got Ella, she is a new addition because she was my uncle's dog but he passed away so we took her. She was housetrained but since we've brought her home she keeps pooping and peeing everywhere in the house. We bought her a crate in the hopes of stopping it but now she just poops in there too and doesn't mind lying in it. We take her out often enough and she gets exercise so why does she do it and how can we stop it?

Also, now that Zack has seen Ella messing in the house he has started doing it too and he never used to.

It won't be soon before we have to get rid of Ella because my mum is at her wits end and I can't be here to help because I'm not here most of the time, only on weekends. We don't know what else to try, any ideas?

[Lara's mom]

I'm trying to put myself in Ella's place. She lost "her person" who I assume she was very attached to. Then, she finds herself in a new home where she is no doubt still grieving and trying to adjust to her new circumstances. It's a fair guess that the routine and the rules of your family are different.

I would suggest that you confine her to a small space with a baby gate rather than crating her when you aren't able to watch her. Put paper down so that any messes can be easily cleaned up. Most of all, be patient with her. She's like a small child (albeit in a large body) who has been orphaned and sent to live with relatives. It has to be a very difficult time for her.

As for Zack, he smells where Ella has gone and assumes that it's alright for him too. It is important to thoroughly clean the area in which any accidents occur. White vinegar is a good and economical cleanser. Don't use any cleaning product that contains ammonia. Ammonia smells just like urine to dogs and will only encourage them to return to that spot again and again.

[CorkyMax]

Originally Posted by Lara's mom

I'm trying to put myself in Ella's place. She lost "her person" who I assume she was very attached to. Then, she finds herself in a new home where she is no doubt still grieving and trying to adjust to her new circumstances. It's a fair guess that the routine and the rules of your family are different.

I would suggest that you confine her to a small space with a baby gate rather than crating her when you aren't able to watch her. Put paper down so that any messes can be easily cleaned up. Most of all, be patient with her. She's like a small child (albeit in a large body) who has been orphaned and sent to live with relatives. It has to be a very difficult time for her.

As for Zack, he smells where Ella has gone and assumes that it's alright for him too. It is important to thoroughly clean the area in which any accidents occur. White vinegar is a good and economical cleanser. Don't use any cleaning product that contains ammonia. Ammonia smells just like urine to dogs and will only encourage them to return to that spot again and again.

Just want to say I agree with Lara's Mom! You need to be (or should say your parents, since you aren't there that often!) --They need to be more patient---Like Lara said--This poor puppy is confused and prob. needs to be potty trained all over again. Hope Ella is getting a lot of loving attention in this 'bad' moment in her life---May be a deciding factor in her future personality! Would hate to see her be rehomed all over again and so soon!
I just looked up in my breeds book on this breed. Very interesting and I quote: Temperament--These gentle, cheerful dogs love children. They are very intelligent, easy to train and are natural watchdogs. THEY ARE VERY LOYAL AND MAY HAVE TROUBLE ADJUSTING TO A NEW OWNER AFTER THEY ARE 18 MONTHS OLD. And in another section ---BE AWARE: THESE ARE ONE-OWNER DOGS AND MAY FIND IT DIFFICULT TO ADJUST TO A NEW OWNER. (unquote) WOW! You got this dog at a critical age for changing owners. This poor baby is going to need a lot of loving attention to try to get her to adjust----I sure hope your parents don't give up on her--If she is moved yet again to a dif. home--She may never be a 'normal' dog again! Please keep us posted as to how things are progressing and I am hoping things turn out okay.

[Todd]

I agree. She is probably very confused in her new home and is probably very nervous/anxious. Be patient with her. Positive reinforcement is the key in this particular situation. is she goes in the crate there is no use crate training her. Take her out very often and praise her/give her a treat when she goes outside. put something down in an enclosed area like Laura's Mom suggested for accidents. I generally don't recommend paper training but sometimes it's necessary. are you home all day or at work? is someone home? how often is the dogs left alone. if a lot it may be beneficial to do paper training, however this makes it harder to transition into just going outside. Again, sometimes it's necessary. Time and patience is the key here. is her stool loose? this would make it hard to hold. does she appear nervous/anxious? you may want to try rescue remedy or some natural anxiety relievers to calm her down;

Best Way - Natural Anxiety Relief for Dogs | eHow.com

As for the other dog, he may be trying to mark over where the other dog went. this is normal. use an odor neutralizer specifically for dogs over the spots where there is waste to eliminate the smell to your dog's nose. This will only completely remove the scent. remember dogs have noses MUCH stronger than our. Hope this helps!

[CorkyMax]

Todd/quote: I generally don't recommend paper training but sometimes it's necessary. are you home all day or at work? is someone home? how often is the dogs left alone. if a lot it may be beneficial to do paper training, however this makes it harder to transition into just going outside. (unquote)

Just wanted to add this little hint to maybe make it easier to transition to go outside----When you let the dog out to go--Take the soiled newspaper to the spot outside that you would like it to do it's 'potty' on--repeat as necessary. Reward if it goes there! After so many times and does it there--take the soiled paper away. Of course you prob. want to start with the dog on leash and leading it to the soiled newspaper area!

[Alex]

Thanks for the comments so far

The main issue with Ella peeing/pooping in the house is that we've had her for almost 4 months now and it doesn't happen all the time. She has days where she's fine with going outside and doesn't have any accidents in the house. It can even be a week where she doesn't pee/poop in the house but then she goes back to doing it again. We can't understand why she's ok some days and not others.

We're going to try giving her praise and treats everytime she goes outside but does that mean we stop giving her treats inside? Or will it not matter if she's given some when she's inside too?

My mum works from home so she's here to let the dogs out during the day and spend time with them for a bit at various points in the day. The dogs aren't often in the house alone as there's usually someone around.

Ella's stool isn't loose, she just seems to go when she pleases sometimes. She doesn't appear anxious, she seems happy here as we used to visit her when my uncle had her so it's not like she's come to live with complete strangers.

[Todd]

Originally Posted by Alex

Thanks for the comments so far

The main issue with Ella peeing/pooping in the house is that we've had her for almost 4 months now and it doesn't happen all the time. She has days where she's fine with going outside and doesn't have any accidents in the house. It can even be a week where she doesn't pee/poop in the house but then she goes back to doing it again. We can't understand why she's ok some days and not others.

We're going to try giving her praise and treats everytime she goes outside but does that mean we stop giving her treats inside? Or will it not matter if she's given some when she's inside too?

My mum works from home so she's here to let the dogs out during the day and spend time with them for a bit at various points in the day. The dogs aren't often in the house alone as there's usually someone around.

Ella's stool isn't loose, she just seems to go when she pleases sometimes. She doesn't appear anxious, she seems happy here as we used to visit her when my uncle had her so it's not like she's come to live with complete strangers.

Just be patient but keep up the hard work. Let her out more often until you see improvements. When she usually goes in the house is there any difference regarding anything at all?

[scrofford]

Originally Posted by Alex

Thanks for the comments so far

The main issue with Ella peeing/pooping in the house is that we've had her for almost 4 months now and it doesn't happen all the time. She has days where she's fine with going outside and doesn't have any accidents in the house. It can even be a week where she doesn't pee/poop in the house but then she goes back to doing it again. We can't understand why she's ok some days and not others.

We're going to try giving her praise and treats everytime she goes outside but does that mean we stop giving her treats inside? Or will it not matter if she's given some when she's inside too?

My mum works from home so she's here to let the dogs out during the day and spend time with them for a bit at various points in the day. The dogs aren't often in the house alone as there's usually someone around.

Ella's stool isn't loose, she just seems to go when she pleases sometimes. She doesn't appear anxious, she seems happy here as we used to visit her when my uncle had her so it's not like she's come to live with complete strangers.

Well to start, she is in a new place and probably misses her original master and probably is somewhat confused. It's good she doesn't do this as much. It is probably going to take some time and patience in order to get Ella to stop this altogether. As far as treats go, I wouldn't reward her for misbehavior. So if she is pooping and peeing in the house, don't give her treats in the house. When she goes outside and does her business, praise her and give her a treat.

You might also want to have her checked by the vet. It could be possible she is having problems in that area. The biggest thing is having patience.

[bpwriter47]

Everyone here has made great suggestions, but I'm wondering if you have any of your Uncle's clothes or jackets?
Perhaps putting something that might have his scent on it in his crate might help him not miss him so much.

I'm not a dog expert so others on here might disagree. It's just a thought since he's been pulled away from everything familiar.

I took on my best friend's jack russell terrier for about a month after she died suddenly and I took one of her sweaters with me, he slept on it and layed on it all the time.

Just a suggestion.

[Lara's mom]

I think your idea has merit. What I'd be concerned about is that having items belonging to the deceased relative will just prolong the grieving process for the dog. I think your idea is wonderful in a temporary situation where the owner is coming back which in this situation is not the case. I have my doubts about this in a situation where the dog has to adjust to a new family.

[Todd]

Originally Posted by Lara's mom

I think your idea has merit. What I'd be concerned about is that having items belonging to the deceased relative will just prolong the grieving process for the dog. I think your idea is wonderful in a temporary situation where the owner is coming back which in this situation is not the case. I have my doubts about this in a situation where the dog has to adjust to a new family.

I agree. Maybe even taking some of his former owner's furniture, if it's still around, would help. Like a chair or small foot stool for him to lie on.

[Lara's mom]

Again Todd, I have to respectfully disagree. The object of this dogs affection is not coming back. Dogs are not able to distinguish memories from reality in the same way that we are. To put things that belonged to this dogs former parent around will only cause the poor thing to continue to grieve for someone who obviously is not coming back. In my opinion, it would be cruelty dressed as kindness.

[Todd]

Originally Posted by Lara's mom

Again Todd, I have to respectfully disagree. The object of this dogs affection is not coming back. Dogs are not able to distinguish memories from reality in the same way that we are. To put things that belonged to this dogs former parent around will only cause the poor thing to continue to grieve for someone who obviously is not coming back. In my opinion, it would be cruelty dressed as kindness.

You're probably right. Guess it would be almost like teasing the poor thing, although dogs obviously think differently than we do some maybe bringing in something larger of her owner's and graduually bringing in smaller and smaller things would help her ease out of the grievence process?

[bpwriter47]

wow, didn't mean to start a debate. I only suggested putting something (a shirt perhaps) with the dog of the deceased because this worked for me.

My best girl friend died suddenly, I got her jack russell terrier temporarily until I could find it a home and the first week was terrible. I'd been given some of her items from the family and so I put a sweater of hers on my bed. It seemed to calm the dog down. He quit chewing on everything in the house and quit peeing everywhere.

Then I would start removing it slowly for a few hours; then a day and then completely. He was fine after that. I think slowly removing it instead of suddenly might have helped.

I don't think dogs think as we do, but some do grieve harder than others and so they are all different. Eventually, within a month, I found an elderly lady who had lost her lap dog and she wanted to have him, so he went with her. He was fine. (not your typical jack russell because my friend got him from a shelter after years of abuse, so he loved to sit in someone's lap). I wish I could have kept him, but I worked a lot and it wouldn't have been fair to him.

It could have been she died so suddenly without warning that was hard on him. Sometimes, you just have to be patient with them and let them grieve. Most the time, dogs move on quickly as long as you do too. good luck.

[Yogi]

Originally Posted by Lara's mom

I think your idea has merit. What I'd be concerned about is that having items belonging to the deceased relative will just prolong the grieving process for the dog. I think your idea is wonderful in a temporary situation where the owner is coming back which in this situation is not the case. I have my doubts about this in a situation where the dog has to adjust to a new family.

I have to agree. As one who has rescued and fostered dogs for many years, this could only hurt in the long run. As noted, if it is just dog sitting, when I do this I ask them to bring the dogs crate and bedding as a sense of security along with their favorite toy.
It is too late but when I introduce a new permanent member to the house I always bath them using the same shampoo I use on the others. By doing this it helps disguise a new scent in the house. In my case I have done this for over 30 years and to my surprise even to this day, it sometimes takes hours for the existing dog to really even know there is a new on in the house. Dogs even sighted oriented dogs work heavily off scent and smell. That can be seen by simply visiting with another dog and going home and watching the reaction of your dog sniffing up and down you pant legs. Eliminating the scent of another dog by disguising it with a scent it is accustomed to has proven extremely successful for me.

[Todd]

Alex, check out this thread;

Grief in Dogs (and cats)

[Alex]

Just thought I would give an update on how Ella is doing. I don't want to jinx it but she seems to have improved, we haven't had an accident in the house for several weeks now. I think she just took a while to settle in but hopefully she's there now

Hopefully all stays well, am trying my best to keep her groomed and washed because my mum thinks she smells. Ella doesn't seem to groom herself much but am trying my hardest to keep her clean. It's going alright so far, i'm sure my mum will learn to love her soon

Thanks for all the help!

[Todd]

Originally Posted by Alex

Just thought I would give an update on how Ella is doing. I don't want to jinx it but she seems to have improved, we haven't had an accident in the house for several weeks now. I think she just took a while to settle in but hopefully she's there now

Hopefully all stays well, am trying my best to keep her groomed and washed because my mum thinks she smells. Ella doesn't seem to groom herself much but am trying my hardest to keep her clean. It's going alright so far, i'm sure my mum will learn to love her soon

Thanks for all the help!

Wonderful! Glad to hear progress is being made! Keep up the good work!